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  • For awhile I just assumed people always support Katara despite her being an unlikeable bitch because they thought she was perfect. But then I realized it's not because people think Katara is inherently perfect. It's because the people she butts heads with are jerks so people think Katara is a poor innocent angel who is being unfairly bullied by the mean assholes.

    Take Pakku for example. He made a smartass comment and refused to duel her when she challenged him, so she assaulted him. Katara was 100% in the wrong to attack Pakku, but she could have murdered his family and bathed in their blood while Pakku watched and people would still say Pakku deserved it for being a bully.

    It's really not about Katara at all. It's all down to attitude people have to bullying, where any form of retaliation, no matter how extreme, is seen as justified because the bullies "had it coming".

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    • Well, yes and no. The murdering his family and and bathing in their blood thing would probably be pushing it, to say the least. People support Katara because she is progressive, at least for an early Industrial Revolution age. As with the Pakku example above, she even flat out says she doesn't care she's not going to win, she's doing it to make a point: showing the people of the Northern Watertribe that an unexperienced girl can give this old master a run for his money. The issues with Jet speak for themselves, and so do those with Zuko. 

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    • Watch your tongue.

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    • MerlinTheFairyFox wrote:
      Watch your tongue.

      Why? 

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    • Onomatopoeia wrote:
      For awhile I just assumed people always support Katara despite her being an unlikeable bitch

      Read that, and LMAO, and thought "I'm reading the rest of this."

      Onomatopoeia wrote:

      Take Pakku for example. He made a smartass comment and refused to duel her when she challenged him, so she assaulted him. Katara was 100% in the wrong to attack Pakku, but she could have murdered his family and bathed in their blood while Pakku watched and people would still say Pakku deserved it for being a bully.

      On this point, I completely agree. I never thought it was right for Katara to attack Pakku. I thought "so she expects this man to change his beliefs and go against his culture just to teach her combat waterbending?"

      I thought no matter how much she disagreed with the culture of the NWT she should have respected it. I don't think she should have blamed him for refusing to teach her waterbending.

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    • How do you close a thread. I want to close this one because of all the cussing

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    • MerlinTheFairyFox wrote: Watch your tongue.

      Thank you😊

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    • Catsrthebest wrote: How do you close a thread. I want to close this one because of all the cussing

      Well, fuck.

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    • Gee thanks. Also I am a girl so stop referring to me as he on all the other threads. And stop trolling me.

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    • I still don't get. Also you are like my worst shipping war enemy right now stop it.

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    • No comment 😜

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    • What?

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    • katara has her flaws but she has her decent development unlike a certain other southern tribe female waterbender

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    • AntJenkins wrote:

      I thought no matter how much she disagreed with the culture of the NWT she should have respected it. I don't think she should have blamed him for refusing to teach her waterbending.

      You're forgetting that the franchise has never let Culture Justify Everything (or choosing "Good" over the "To Be Lawful or be Good" question,) especially when said culture goes against said franchise's Central Theme of equality. The Fire Nation was in the wrong/out of balance invading other nations, the Earth Queen was in the wrong/out of balance in abducting the new Air Nation despite Bumi arguing conscription and the Water Tribes were in the wrong in the sexism. Pakku's sexism/entitlement cost him Kanna (until decades later) and not only disrespected/ignored Katara's accomplishments in aiding The Avatar in reaching the NWT, said sexism was impractical in nearly costing the fate of the world for not aiding a proven warrior against the enemy and then refusing to train The Avatar, himself for not following suit in said bigotry. Just like Piando was in the right for believing that the arts/swordsmanship shouldn't be restricted to just Fire Nationals, Katara, crude or not, was in the right in challenging him and had the moral victory because of it.


      Plank2x4 wrote: katara has her flaws but she has her decent development unlike a certain other southern tribe female waterbender

      Weak trolling again, you don't like Korra, you stubbornly ignore why she was the way she was and especially the legit character development she went through, which was far more than Aang needing not one, but two Deus Ex Machinas to save his ass.

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    • I don't ignore it I just don't give a fuck about a vague character that fucks shit up without any consequences because she's the avatar nor earn anything to even justify her as the avatar instead it's all given and she can't live without it. she didn't even took out that shitty villain from her trash comics you just like the fandom is blind to see what the "sequel" truly is

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    • Weak trolling again, you don't like Korra, you stubbornly ignore why she was the way she was and especially the legit character development she went through, which was far more than Aang needing not one, but two Deus Ex Machinas to save his ass.

      Oh, so he's back to forcing that through again, I was wondering what he was on about.

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    • Plank2x4 wrote: I don't ignore it I just don't give a fuck about a vague character that fucks shit up without any consequences because she's the avatar nor earn anything to even justify her as the avatar instead it's all given and she can't live without it. she didn't even took out that shitty villain from her trash comics you just like the fandom is blind to see what the "sequel" truly is

      Yeah, you're ignoring it.

      It doesn't look like you know what "vague" means either when Korra has a clear character development over the seasons, she's absolutely faced consequences for her actions and beats herself up over it constantly (ex. "Remembrances" is basically Asami and Tenzin giving her a pep talk) and she you conveniently forget/ignore (again) that she beat Kuvira solo without using the AS and would've done it faster had Mako not blown the damn thing up.

      And not only are you a broken record, but it's the same Nostalgia-blind bisonshit that not only excuses Aang's flaws to dump on Korra, it's also clearly ignoring Katara's foibles such as "The Waterbending Scroll" all being because she was jealous of Aang's skills and stole the titular scroll from pirates that got her temporarily captured. This coming from a girl who has no such excuse of a sheltered upbringing yet everybody's too busy shipping her to remember that tidbit.

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    • she's a clear character alright a clear psychopath what consequences exactly? she was pardoned for her crimes on the first episode and she still taunted the officer who released her whatever she accomplished or achieved obviously had no meaning if it's forgettable considering you only mentioned one

      but I still remember the time katara was in awe at aang an her other flawed moments a specially the one where she searched for justice upon her mother's killer and not only did she speared him but she didn't forgive him something korra could never do she would have done worse and turn to the worst but at least she's not worse than psycho azula so I will give you that

      and for the record I like things that grow to earn it rightfully instead of just liking just because you're a blind simpleton

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    • Every person has it's own flaws and greatness, so you can't compare the characters, and some people may like them, some may not, that's how it goes, so I think you two should stop arguing. It leads to nowhere.

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    • and some aren't even aware what they watch or why

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    • Well people can watch it however they want. Maybe they watch it for fun, so they don't care about the flaws. Some people are watchful and they notice flaws and interesting stuff. Some people just don't care. I am all of those people. Sometimes I notice good paralells in the stories, sometimes I notice flaws, sometimes many things go unnoticed for me. I often go with the wave of just... watching it. But there times when I notice stuff. Hm, I am not good at this.

      With the show, well, I watched it and thought : oh now this character does this, I wonder what will happen.... Now I did not except this to happen... Or... Yay, what I imagined come true, yaay, I was intuitive (really, I am amazed, because I am usually just plain dumb...) I just don't judge people in shows. I just enjoy it. They are fictional people. I know that they are good or they are evil or they are complex. I always root for either side since I was a child. I want to know what will happen if the good guys win, but I also want to know what will happen if the evil guys win. Of course sometimes I think : wow that was so cruel. But then I move on. That is why I cannot comment any relevant thing here. :/

      Well, what ever, this was irrelevant, but I thought I may write something. :(

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    • Well people can watch it however they want. Maybe they watch it for fun, so they don't care about the flaws. Some people are watchful and they notice flaws and interesting stuff.

      I just don't think Plank's dichotomy is well supported anywhere other than his own mind. O-kei soundly rebutted him, & he responded with a frankly poorly spelled post dodging the counterpoints & insulting them. Looks a lot more like blind hatred than some impartial bastion of reason.

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    • don't presume my mindset boy I just gave my view of the series and frankly I don't care about korra nor it's universe I am here to discuss about the avatar last air bender universe but someone just had to poorly defend korra just because I stated the truth this fucker started it

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    • don't presume my mindset

      You have absolutely no business demanding this.

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    • Ok, everybody is entitled to their own opinion, so nobody gonna win the argument. Let's talk about the topic

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    • The topic is also biased & has been dead for a year.

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    • Plank2x4 wrote: don't presume my mindset boy I just gave my view of the series and frankly I don't care about korra nor it's universe I am here to discuss about the avatar last air bender universe but someone just had to poorly defend korra just because I stated the truth this fucker started it

      1. "don't presume my mindset boy" not only makes you sound like an Internet Tough Guy, but a redneck Internet Tough Guy right down to the chewing tobacco and pick-up truck. While we've all had spelling mistakes at one time or another for varying reasons, it looked like you rage-typed so angrily that I wouldn't be surprised if you got spittle on the screen.

      2. You're worse than Ganso and reminding me of Ironbender in not being able to refute (claiming my post was "poorly defended" yet not being able to challenge me and/or back-up what you're claiming is eye-rollingly ironic) and instead double-down by making shit up, demonizing characters (because Korra sure is "psycho" for running from the cops after she wrecked property in the process of beating up thugs /s) and then insulting other posters for calling you out on it. It feels more like a matter of "when" than "if" you get a warning or even banned at this rate.

      3. For someone who's "only here to discuss about the avatar last air bender universe" (which is the same universe, btw, so chalk that up as another word you keep using, but don't know what it means,) you still not only keep shit-talking about Korra anyway, you also go to threads explicitly about her/her series, meaning like an MGTOW, you still obsess about what you claim you're avoiding to the extent of necroposting threads that have been dead for at least a year.

      Hunprincess wrote: Ok, everybody is entitled to their own opinion, so nobody gonna win the argument. Let's talk about the topic

      1. No, we're not doing that "agree to disagree" mess because this isn't just another debate, it's another case of a troll shit-posting then talking shit because others are calling him out on both parts.

      and 2. When the OP is kicking things off with "I just assumed people always support Katara despite her being an unlikeable bitch" we not exactly talking about bending metaphysics or which species of winged lemur's cuter.

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    • I can go in full depth but you didn't have specific points and scenes and I don't like folks who assume of me it's redundant

      I also don't give a damn but I can still acknowledge it when necessary like when I want to post something simple on the korra posts because there's nothing to add on

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    • If you could, you would've instead of just claiming you could. It reminds of this. All you've done is dig up old-ass threats, leave an ignorant one or two sentence blurb then piss off to the next one like a bird shitting on an old care.

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    • You're just complaining about shit you do almost constantly. You keep accusing people who disagree with you of being "too blind," & where are the the "specific points" proving Korra is a "psychopath" or would have killed Yon Rha?

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    • O-kei Dou-kei wrote:

      and 2. When the OP is kicking things off with "I just assumed people always support Katara despite her being an unlikeable bitch" we not exactly talking about bending metaphysics or which species of winged lemur's cuter.

      What do you mean? Sorry I'm being dumb. :/

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    • Hunprincess wrote:

      O-kei Dou-kei wrote:

      and 2. When the OP is kicking things off with "I just assumed people always support Katara despite her being an unlikeable bitch" we not exactly talking about bending metaphysics or which species of winged lemur's cuter.

      What do you mean? Sorry I'm being dumb. :/

      Read Onomatopoeia's post at the top of the page. This thread started with bias and a lack of tact and it's been dredged up by a troll to continue doing just that, so the proverbial ship hadn't sailed because it was never at the dock to begin with.

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    • when korra stopped the triple triads in the first episode on her own and resisted arrest, usually when you do something bad under authority's eye you're supposed to accept their terms and stand down as a respect of the officers and their jurisdiction

      korra just ran away after taking the law in her own hands while causing collateral damage like she didn't care about the lives she almost put to risk or did she think she could be pardoned because she's the avatar

      katara on the other hand went mad in the first episode because of a sexist remark causing her to destroy an ice berg that had the avatar which after freeing him got the attention of a firenation ship. stole a waterbending scroll because she thought it's ok to steal from pirates. then was in complete awe that her student was a good waterbender than her. was bigoted towards zuko when he officially joined team avatar.

      these and many more were katara's flawed moments but in return she learned and experienced those in order to face yon rah in the future, had she finished him off she would have strayed into the same path as gilak if not worse

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    • Korra doesn't know legal procedure because again, cooped up at a compound. Concepts like paying for food or that the fish in the park being public property are explicitly new to her. She's been trained to beat bad guys, she beat bad guys, doesn't get property damage is a crime, too, so she books. She doesn't "put any lives at risk" as the most damaging thing she does is shake off Officer Song by raising an ice wall. Not only does that not a "psychopath" make, the Gaang likely killed plenty of FN soldiers in blowing up their ships or dumping armor-wearing soldiers into the middle of the ocean yet nobody calls them the Manson Family, now do they?

      Katara was "bigoted" (again, one more word you're not using right,) against Zuko because besides having beaten her up w/o literal soldiers/hired guns helping him and tried to kidnap her friend on multiple occasions, you're (unsurprisingly) ignoring the fact that she explicitly gave him a chance at the end of Book 2 when they were locked up together and bonded over their lost mothers. She even contemplated healing his scar with the Spirit Water before Aang and Iroh broke in, so him siding with Azula against her was a MASSIVE slap in the face that she never forgave him for until the Yon Rha incident. She didn't spare him because "she learned and experienced those flawed moments," she spared him because he was so goddamn pathetic that he tried to offer his own mother (which was clearly doing him a favor,) that it wouldn't be worth it. At the same time, she realized that Zuko did deserve forgiveness because he actually sought to make amends considering the lengths he went through for her to forgive him. Those "flawed" moments of her losing her temper are righteous indignations as had she never raged at Sokka, Aang would remain frozen and her backing down from Pakku would keep him a sexist douche, prevent her from mastering waterbending and the rest of the war to be a wash.

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    • if one committed something wrong in an area they don't know it's government system surely the logical thing to do is to be civil towards the up holders of the law instead of running away and causing minor mayhem as if they know what's better

      isolation doesn't excuse the fact that she can't analyze the situation by realizing she's isn't in the south pole in her home of comfort considering she experienced a few things in the city before confronting the triple triads it's called logic does she ever uses it? overall it's the worst way to write a character

      but here's the thing with katara and why she was actually bigoted towards zuko remember that she knew the motive of zuko which was to capture the avatar yet after he found them in book three she knew he wasn't a threat at that time she even alluded to threatening and even "assaulted" him with water zuko even showed humility towards them. after zuko joined she threatened zuko then later on she mocked zuko as if she looked down upon him because of where he's from and as as if she associated him to the same person who killed her mother, hell even after saving her from the debris she didn't even thanked him and afterwards when the team congratulated zuko for helping with the escape she completely neglected it than she came clean about why she couldn't tolerate him and she even blamed him for having her mother killed like he was responsible, it looked like to the audience she was holding a grudge but to me that grudge was converted to bigotry: the psychical conflict verbal abuse grudge negative association prejudice if katara treated zuko like that do you really think she could have turned better if she killed yon rah? avatar was a dark series after all

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    • You were originally calling her a "psychopath" & saying she "didn't care about people's lives," now you're saying she should've been "civil" & what she did wasn't "logical." But being rude or making mistakes does not a psychopath make.

      Also, it's not illogical to run from law enforcement in the first place, because the assumption that you're safest if you cooperate isn't necessarily true. Sometimes there are bad cops or unjust laws. I'd say that, while Korra made some mistakes in this specific case, it actually tells us more about the flaws of the RCPD. Let's look at their complaints against her:

      Charge: Korra shouldn't be engaging in vigilantism.

      Problem: She didn't. She defended a civilian in a crime she happened to witness, that's defense or self or others, which is a different thing. Vigilantism is specifically aimed at people who go out "patrolling" for trouble. It's also silly because Korra is essentially a cosmically-ordained superhero recognized by the whole world, & even the cops eventually drop this nonsense & accept Korra's help because it's just fucking absurd for a city founded by the Avatar to not recognize the Avatar.

      Charge: Property damage.

      Problem: Since Korra was acting in reasonable defense of self or others, it makes no sense to hold her responsible for this. Is there no property insurance? If not, why isn't it the Triple Threats' responsibility to cover the damage, seeing as they started it?

      Also, it's worth noting that Korra is a potential witness against the Triple Threats--y'know, the serious criminals who are members of a large organization. It's no wonder Republic City is in such a state if this is the law's priorities. I don't think they had any good reason to escalate the situation like they did, particularly when the charges against Korra were so questionable in the first place. If they want her to act more responsibly, that's what warnings & lectures on how to be a good Samaritan are for.

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    • she still resisted arrest she didn't even get to realize if she was dealing with dirty cops she just escaped as soon as she was declared to be under arrest and she dipped not to mention she destroyed the area when fighting the triads surely she was thought of personal belongings or did she knew and she just destroyed all the shit for fun

      because I am sure she could have handled the triads without breaking most of the work places she's the avatar after all

      another thing the avatar is never supposed to be a hero or choose sides he only brings balance to the world so it's a justice kind of thing than hero

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    • Plank2x4 wrote: but here's the thing with katara and why she was actually bigoted towards zuko remember that she knew the motive of zuko which was to capture the avatar yet after he found them in book three she knew he wasn't a threat at that time she even alluded to threatening and even "assaulted" him with water zuko even showed humility towards them. after zuko joined she threatened zuko then later on she mocked zuko as if she looked down upon him because of where he's from and as as if she associated him to the same person who killed her mother, hell even after saving her from the debris she didn't even thanked him and afterwards when the team congratulated zuko for helping with the escape she completely neglected it than she came clean about why she couldn't tolerate him and she even blamed him for having her mother killed like he was responsible, it looked like to the audience she was holding a grudge but to me that grudge was converted to bigotry: the psychical conflict verbal abuse grudge negative association prejudice if katara treated zuko like that do you really think she could have turned better if she killed yon rah? avatar was a dark series after all

      Well, since Neo already put holes in the legal part, (thanks, Neo, btw,) first off, Inigo Montoya would like a word with you about using "bigoted" when her issue with Zuko is more about who he is as a person (an enemy who betrayed her trust at the worst possible time and nearly got her friend permanently killed,) than what he is (a Fire National). Yes, what she said about reconquering Ba Sing Se and bringing back are referring to what his people have done, but she then literally states that she trusted him before the others and he betrayed said trust.

      And again, she threatened Zuko after the rest of the group accepted him because she was still understandably pissed at betraying her, only tolerated him for the sake of Aang learning firebending and implies she will kill him if he tries anything funny again. She shits on him because he still hadn't redeemed himself in her eyes until the Yon Rha mission where she finally recognizes that she shouldn't hold a grudge against someone who's legit making an effort to atone considering the lengths he went through to do so. THAT was the lesson there.

      Plank2x4 wrote: she still resisted arrest she didn't even get to realize if she was dealing with dirty cops she just escaped as soon as she was declared to be under arrest and she dipped not to mention she destroyed the area when fighting the triads surely she was thought of personal belongings or did she knew and she just destroyed all the shit for fun

      because I am sure she could have handled the triads without breaking most of the work places she's the avatar after all

      another thing the avatar is never supposed to be a hero or choose sides he only brings balance to the world so it's a justice kind of thing than hero

      Again, what part of "she doesn't get city protocol" do you not get?

      First you were claiming she's a "psychopath" and now you're claiming she should have a Bachelor's in Criminal Justice despite again, not even used to used to PAYING for things. She was already established as rough-and-tumble in how she handled her opponents for her firebending test, wasn't even supposed to be in Republic City and yet you're expecting her to take a delicate touch when she clearly expected the cops to simply say, "Thanks for rounding up these ruffians, m'lady"?

      Come. On. You're just grasping at straws here.

      And besides Neo's point about the cops escalating things, The Avatar has carte blanche to do whatever they damn well please to get the job done (funny as that sounds like the precursor to the Spectres from "Mass Effect" as Jennifer Hale voice Female Shepard and Kiyoshi who both do just that,) whether the job's street criminals (ex. Yakone) or wrathful spirits, plus Tenzin, himself later states that Lin's still bitter over her past with him.

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    • she still resisted arrest

      Right, but you see, I don't consider "she resisted the arrest that probably shouldn't have happened to begin with" to be a compelling point.

      she didn't even get to realize if she was dealing with dirty cops

      But that's the point I'm making, dealing with a law system you know nothing about is an unknown risk. You can't just tease out what they're going to do with you, you have to make a decision. The reason we say to cooperate with police isn't because it's not logical to flee a situation you're afraid of, it's to make the jobs of the cops & the courts easier.

      she just escaped as soon as she was declared to be under arrestland she dipped

      This isn't entirely correct. From the episode transcript on this site, she runs away once Naga attacks one of the cops, which came after increased aggression from their end. As in, right before that, she was almost hit by a cable swung hard enough to crack stone. She actually hadn't attacked the cops before that. That's the kind of thing I mean by "inappropriate escalation."

      not to mention she destroyed the area when fighting the triads surely she was thought of personal belongings or did she knew and she just destroyed all the shit for fun

      Fights are hectic & you become focused on doing what you need to in order to stop the threat, so people are generally given the benefit of the doubt in self-defense. Apparently, the RCPD doesn't think so, & that's one of the reasons I think their priorities are bass-ackwards.

      because I am sure she could have handled the triads without breaking most of the work places she's the avatar after all

      Again, they can warn her that they'll take future action if she isn't more careful. You put all this emphasis on what Korra could've done differently, but the cops have a lot of power too, not to mention way more experience, so I don't see why they should just get a pass. Just because they're cops doesn't mean they're automatically right, if anything they should be held to a higher standard.

      another thing the avatar is never supposed to be a hero or choose sides

      This goes against the entirety of the first series. Nothing prohibits the Avatar from "taking sides" or defending people, they've all done it. What they're not supposed to do is show favoritism, taking a side for selfish reasons.

      so it's a justice kind of thing than hero

      Heroes are unrelated to justice?

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    • what's wrong with the word bigotry? ok maybe or maybe not katara had something less than bigotry towards zuko but it could have converted to it or worse

      because to me katara had some similarities with gilak because of the way she treated zuko

      because her confronting yon rah wasn't just a blast to the past or seeking justice this entire conflict would have changed katara's mindset from better to worst considering she spared yon rah from repeating the cycle, being the bigger person or becoming the just like yon rah to me it's just an excuse of what katara had really in mind

      their motives are determined by their mindset but their actions always comes from their heart, because true actions overshadow the character's true motives

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    • remember that katara intentionally used blood bending which is something she vowed to never utilize

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    • Plank2x4 wrote: what's wrong with the word bigotry? ok maybe or maybe not katara had something less than bigotry towards zuko but it could have converted to it or worse

      because to me katara had some similarities with gilak because of the way she treated zuko

      because her confronting yon rah wasn't just a blast to the past or seeking justice this entire conflict would have changed katara's mindset from better to worst considering she spared yon rah from repeating the cycle, being the bigger person or becoming the just like yon rah to me it's just an excuse of what katara had really in mind

      their motives are determined by their mindset but their actions always comes from their heart, because true actions overshadow the character's true motives

      "Bigotry" would be a blind irrational hatred of those of another group. Hating the Fire Nation because they've invaded your country and killed your parents is rational. Jet harassing a harmless old FN civilian just for being Fire Nation is bigotry.

      Real life example: Americans hating Japan for Pearl Harbor is rational, interning Japanese-American citizens with no political ties to Japan is bigotry.

      Gilak had a blind hatred of all foreigners to the extent of being willing to kill the innocent Earth King, didn't believe former enemies can change and was extremist enough that he tried to kill his own kinsman for being "traitors". Besides Sokka drawing the line at Jet's above actions, Katara and Sokka have no hatred for the average FN citizen/civilian going about their day, especially as they rescued them from Hama. If she were a true bigot, she'd be bothered by even being around them and leaving them to rot.

      Katara rationally hated Zuko for being an invader that's repeatedly tried to kidnap her friend, saw past it over the common ground of their missing mothers and then hated him again when he betrayed that trust to be no different than said invaders until he busted his ass for her to forgive him.

      Book 3 in general was about Katara not going down that dark path of blind hatred that consumed Jet and Hama that she was clearly on the brink of doing, which was reflected by her using bloodbending, (yes, I remember and even if I didn't, we're on the wikia site about it,) and being on the verge of killing Yon Rha, but she didn't cross that line. Seriously, if you're saying that makes her "crazy" or whatever, then you might as well say that about Luke Skywalker almost killing Vader, but refusing to do so.

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