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The fight between the Avatar and the Dark Avatar

  • The Avatar can bend 4 elements. The Dark Avatar 1. The Avatar has the knoweledge of hundreds of past lives. The Dark Avatar none. This battle took place during the Era of Raava when the Avatar was going strong, so naturally Raava should be more powerful than Vaatu. How could Korra not win?

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    • What are you talking about?! If you watched the final four episodes you would know something. Go on Nickelodeon website right now and watch the final two episodes that were put up at midnight

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    • or go to GOGOANIME

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    • Avatar Minato wrote:
      What are you talking about?! If you watched the final four episodes you would know something. Go on Nickelodeon website right now and watch the final two episodes that were put up at midnight

      I did. What am i missing?

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    • That Korra has won.

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    • AvatarLance wrote:
      That Korra has won.


      I know that . Im saying when they were fighting next to the tree of life how did Unalaq hold his own. Korra is obviously way more powerful.

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    • I made a fanfiction with my friends 2 years ago and one of the main villans was a dark avatar, or as we call it, the Antipode. I feel like my entire fanfiction isn't so original anymore because our idea is now a part of the actual series

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    • but I still think its cool

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    • Well, it's an established fact that Unalaq is a SUPER skilled and powerful waterbender, so he can hold his own fairly well with it against the other elements.

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    • Sonutaka wrote:
      I made a fanfiction with my friends 2 years ago and one of the main villans was a dark avatar, or as we call it, the Antipode. I feel like my entire fanfiction isn't so original anymore because our idea is now a part of the actual series


      Got a timestamp? If you do, go to Nick and show them that. You'll either be famous or get royalties.

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    • Heyheyheyy22 wrote:
      The Avatar can bend 4 elements. The Dark Avatar 1. The Avatar has the knoweledge of hundreds of past lives. The Dark Avatar none. This battle took place during the Era of Raava when the Avatar was going strong, so naturally Raava should be more powerful than Vaatu. How could Korra not win?

      The Avatar can bend 5, if you go along the 'energybending' hocus-focus, and the Dark Avatar loved using the "Spirit Conversion" water tentacle shenanigan. PLUS, when Dark Avatar goes to the physical world, he MAKES A FISSURE on the ground, traps Korra and begins to close it. Isn't that supposed to be, ya'know, Earthbending?

      With the whole "evil counterpart" thing, I was actually kinda expecting Dark Avatar to suddenly firebend and airbend too ... but that would've been too out in the open.


      And ripping out Raava was like ... OK, that was unexpected. In fact, I would love them to explain how's that supposed to work. The Avatar was supposed to be BONDED FOR ETERNITY.

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    • @YoraeKaiser: The ground in that spot was made of ice so the fissure Unalaq made there was through waterbending.

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    • I myself was a bit surprised that Korra+Raava vs. Unalaq and Vaatu initially ended with the dark side winning, as I thought it was evidenced earlier that Korra was a better bender than Unalaq (didnt she beat him pretty handly when they were in the prison looking for Tonraq? and she was not even using the avatar state). However, the only reason I could see the result we saw happening is Vaatu is in fact alot more powerful than Raava, as Wan and Raava even together struggled immensely to defeat him alone (although wasnt he so powerful because it was the time of darkness or something along those lines?). With the addition of Unalaq's talent in bending, I guess it could have been enough to enable him to beat Korra and Braava initially.

      As for Korra's past lives, I am surprised they didnt play a bigger role, as is has been evidenced several times that even expert "mono" benders stand no chance against someone with multiple elemental mastery (Aang holding his own relatively well against Ozai even before using the avatar state and then winning handely with it). This I would think would give Korra and Raava the edge over Unalaq and Vaatu, but I guess if Vaatu is still that powerful then the match would be even, thus making it possible for the initial outcome we saw.

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    • I don't know what you're referring to with that 'time of darkness'. It was Harmonic Convergence, the battle between good and evil, that's what it was.

      Korra isn't a better waterbender than Unalaq. Unalaq is so skilled and powerful in waterbending that he can stand his ground pretty well with it against the other bending arts. The fact that Korra beat him so easily in prison was because one he didn't have much water handy, and two he was probably just messing with Korra letting her have this victory easy as it didn't really matter anyway at that point.

      Wan and Raava together didn't struggle at all to defeat Vaatu. Right after Wan fused with Raava he caught Vaatu in an elemental sphere and put him in the tree of time, without any effort at all. Korra had almost done the very same thing to Vaatu again, if it wasn't for Unalaq waterbending her away just before she could finish it.

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    • YoraeKaiser wrote:
      And ripping out Raava was like ... OK, that was unexpected. In fact, I would love them to explain how's that supposed to work. The Avatar was supposed to be BONDED FOR ETERNITY.

      exactly.

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    • Intelligence4 wrote:
      YoraeKaiser wrote:
      And ripping out Raava was like ... OK, that was unexpected. In fact, I would love them to explain how's that supposed to work. The Avatar was supposed to be BONDED FOR ETERNITY.
      exactly.

      I think it's just because Raava and Vaatu have a really strong connection to each other.

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    • but that bond was broken, and raava and wan supposably became one.

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    • Intelligence4 wrote:
      but that bond was broken, and raava and wan supposably became one.

      I think the physical bond was indeed broken, but the spiritual bond was still there because they're opposites. So the only thing that could take away the good out of Korra was evil. I hope that makes sense :p

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    • Brilam wrote:

      I think it's just because Raava and Vaatu have a really strong connection to each other.

      Intelligence4 wrote:

      but that bond was broken, and raava and wan supposably became one.

      Yup. Here's the problem, lack of consistency: Raava and Wan fused to become a new entity, the Avatar Spirit. This much has been established. That's even the reason why Unalaq dies in the end; he was fused with Vaatu so that when Korra did the spirit conversion plot power, she destroyed Vaatu AND Unalaq.

      Remember her speech to the twins? Vaatu and Unalaq weren't fused for even a complete day and he was already beyond the point where "CTRL+Z" was a possibility.

      And then Vaatu can rip Raava, who's been fused with Wan as the Avatar Spirit long enough to have a whole temple full of statues dedicated to them? Just like that, blink of an eye?

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    • Intelligence4 wrote:
      YoraeKaiser wrote:
      And ripping out Raava was like ... OK, that was unexpected. In fact, I would love them to explain how's that supposed to work. The Avatar was supposed to be BONDED FOR ETERNITY.
      exactly.

      Ugh, talk about major last minute plotholes -_-

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    • AvatarLance wrote:
      I don't know what you're referring to with that 'time of darkness'. It was Harmonic Convergence, the battle between good and evil, that's what it was.

      Korra isn't a better waterbender than Unalaq. Unalaq is so skilled and powerful in waterbending that he can stand his ground pretty well with it against the other bending arts. The fact that Korra beat him so easily in prison was because one he didn't have much water handy, and two he was probably just messing with Korra letting her have this victory easy as it didn't really matter anyway at that point.

      Wan and Raava together didn't struggle at all to defeat Vaatu. Right after Wan fused with Raava he caught Vaatu in an elemental sphere and put him in the tree of time, without any effort at all. Korra had almost done the very same thing to Vaatu again, if it wasn't for Unalaq waterbending her away just before she could finish it.

      Geez I missed a lot of facts, but thank you for clarifying all this. I guess I didnt have a good explination after all.

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    • I loved seeng Raava come back in her full size again and how she willingly Wants to be rejoin to form the avatar instead of being her own spirit again, it shows her character has come full circle as she originally didnt really like humans and Wan showed her the good in humanity and now she wants to rejoin with a  human.

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    • the reason why vaatu was able to easily remove raava from korra is because they are only fused as one during the avatar state and unfuse when leaving the avatar state. analogy: think of a bridge on one side is korra and her spirit and on the other side raava and all korras past lives as one and when they go into the avatar state they run to the middle of the bridge becoming one and opposite when they unfuse (leave the avatar state) that also is why unalaq died when korra banished him fused with vaatu because they didn't unfuse like every time korra and raava do every time they leave the avatar state which is the reason vaatu was easily able to remove raava from korra because they wheren't fused and raava was just hiding within korra body

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    • thats why they say the avatar would cease to exist if the avatar died while in the avatar state because they don't only kill the avatar they kill raava and all the avatars past lives as well

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    • the tree also showed that raava and vaatu aren't the only spirits that can boost abilities like how the tree boosted kataras spirit to make a super powered astral projection of korra wich means the tree boosted korras ability to energy bend herself when she became one with her spiritual side

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    • Englishandy wrote:
      thats why they say the avatar would cease to exist if the avatar died while in the avatar state because they don't only kill the avatar they kill raava and all the avatars past lives as well

      but that is what happened when vaatu killed raava he destroyed the avatars past live that where within raava who held them off from passing on to the other side and iroh also showed that you could choose to remove your spirit from your body and permanently put it into the spirit world allowing you to become a spirit

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    • Englishandy wrote:
      the reason why vaatu was able to easily remove raava from korra is because they are only fused as one during the avatar state and unfuse when leaving the avatar state. analogy: think of a bridge on one side is korra and her spirit and on the other side raava and all korras past lives as one and when they go into the avatar state they run to the middle of the bridge becoming one and opposite when they unfuse (leave the avatar state) that also is why unalaq died when korra banished him fused with vaatu because they didn't unfuse like every time korra and raava do every time they leave the avatar state which is the reason vaatu was easily able to remove raava from korra because they wheren't fused and raava was just hiding within korra body
      Englishandy wrote:
      thats why they say the avatar would cease to exist if the avatar died while in the avatar state because they don't only kill the avatar they kill raava and all the avatars past lives as well

      This is most likely the way it really is.

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    • Englishandy wrote:
      Englishandy wrote:
      thats why they say the avatar would cease to exist if the avatar died while in the avatar state because they don't only kill the avatar they kill raava and all the avatars past lives as well
      but that is what happened when vaatu killed raava he destroyed the avatars past live that where within raava who held them off from passing on to the other side and iroh also showed that you could choose to remove your spirit from your body and permanently put it into the spirit world allowing you to become a spirit

      The Avatar's past lives weren't destroyed/gone/lost, just Korra and Raava's connection to them was lost.

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    • "PLUS, when Dark Avatar goes to the physical world, he MAKES A FISSURE on the ground, traps Korra and begins to close it. Isn't that supposed to be, ya'know, Earthbending?"

      No. If you look carefully, the inside of the ground is smooth & reflective. They're fighting on top of a glacier.

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    • Neo Bahamut wrote:
      "PLUS, when Dark Avatar goes to the physical world, he MAKES A FISSURE on the ground, traps Korra and begins to close it. Isn't that supposed to be, ya'know, Earthbending?"

      No. If you look carefully, the inside of the ground is smooth & reflective. They're fighting on top of a glacier.

      Exactly! He breaks the ground open through waterbending.

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    • I can't remember the exact phrase but as Unalaq said korra was barely aware of her spiritual side but Unalaq, being a spiritual master would become incredibly powerful when bonded to Vaatu as he would be fully aware of his 'spirit power' potential. I think this is why Vaatu initially defeated Korra/Raava

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    • ould Unolaq really becames more powerfull than all past avatar's lives? PLease...


      And about the fight - I like idea of Korra's connection with universe energy but...the battle with Vatu turns often to normal benders fights...

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    • The fight scenes are okay but they really need to add some massive explosions when Light and Dark Avatars clash in a brutal battle to make it look epic and awesome! like Fairy Tail for example.

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    • Warmachine375 wrote:
      The fight scenes are okay but they really need to add some massive explosions when Light and Dark Avatars clash in a brutal battle to make it look epic and awesome! like Fairy Tail for example.

      Fairty Tail should never be an example for anything, except writing excrement maybe. 


      The fight was way to DB for my liking and a little too random. And inconsistent. They write Korra as a wealking when it comes to big fights. 

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    • 00Paper bag princess00 wrote:
      I can't remember the exact phrase but as Unalaq said korra was barely aware of her spiritual side but Unalaq, being a spiritual master would become incredibly powerful when bonded to Vaatu as he would be fully aware of his 'spirit power' potential. I think this is why Vaatu initially defeated Korra/Raava

      While this is true, didn't Korra's connection spiritually get stronger when she learned about Wan?  Also, didn't she also learn something about spirituality from Unalaq while she was training from him, as she learned his spirit calming technique? You do a have a point though, chances are Korra's spiritual understanding could still have been below Unalaq's.

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    • Ok let's all go back to the beginning and review. The Avatar State is being able to recall all your past lives' powers and experiences and imbue them into the current Avatar correct? Then that should mean that every new Avatar is stronger than the previous due to the former Avatar's addded experience to the cycle. What I think some people are trying to say is that how come Korra wasn't able to deal with the Dark Avatar efficiently if she had the combined powers and experiences of the past Avatars at her disposal while Unalaq was the first of his kind

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    • Mexiamerican55 wrote:
      Ok let's all go back to the beginning and review. The Avatar State is being able to recall all your past lives' powers and experiences and imbue them into the current Avatar correct? Then that should mean that every new Avatar is stronger than the previous due to the former Avatar's addded experience to the cycle. What I think some people are trying to say is that how come Korra wasn't able to deal with the Dark Avatar efficiently if she had the combined powers and experiences of the past Avatars at her disposal while Unalaq was the first of his kind

      thats what im saying there should've been no contest


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    • During the Avatar State, and Avatar has access to the knowledge and life experiences of all the past Avatar incarnation, but I don't think they also get their 'power'. The increase in power during the Avatar State is due to Raava channeling her full power through the Avatar's body, strengthening their bending. I think it's like that.

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    • I think we're all missing a rather important point here; where's Vaatu? I was left under the impression he was destroyed by Korra with her purification-style waterbending, but Raava herself claimed that 'one cannot exist without the other'. It's all very nice that it works conviniantely for the good guys and Raava gets reborn inside Vaatu with Jinora's help, but why doesn't that work the other way around? 

      All I'm trying to say here really is that according to all laws of logic and balance, if Vaatu got destroyed- as opposed to getting sealed away again- so should have been Raava.

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    • Just as the pendulum swings on way it must swing the other. I guess the other way was 5 minutes trying to destroy a city.

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    • CloudTemplar wrote:
      I think we're all missing a rather important point here; where's Vaatu? I was left under the impression he was destroyed by Korra with her purification-style waterbending, but Raava herself claimed that 'one cannot exist without the other'. It's all very nice that it works conviniantely for the good guys and Raava gets reborn inside Vaatu with Jinora's help, but why doesn't that work the other way around? 

      All I'm trying to say here really is that according to all laws of logic and balance, if Vaatu got destroyed- as opposed to getting sealed away again- so should have been Raava.


      Vaatu is now inside Raava, and after 10,000 years, at the next HC, he will come out again and the battle between good and evil will have to take place once again to decide the fate of the next 10,000 years after that (unless the Avatar finds a way to prevent HC from happening and locking Vaatu away again for the enxt 10,000 years)

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    • AvatarLance wrote:

      CloudTemplar wrote:
      I think we're all missing a rather important point here; where's Vaatu? I was left under the impression he was destroyed by Korra with her purification-style waterbending, but Raava herself claimed that 'one cannot exist without the other'. It's all very nice that it works conviniantely for the good guys and Raava gets reborn inside Vaatu with Jinora's help, but why doesn't that work the other way around? 

      All I'm trying to say here really is that according to all laws of logic and balance, if Vaatu got destroyed- as opposed to getting sealed away again- so should have been Raava.


      Vaatu is now inside Raava, and after 10,000 years, at the next HC, he will come out again and the battle between good and evil will have to take place once again to decide the fate of the next 10,000 years after that (unless the Avatar finds a way to prevent HC from happening and locking Vaatu away again for the enxt 10,000 years)

      And until then the spirit of evil and darkness and chaos won't exist? Where's the balance in that? If you're right, light will exist without the presence of darkness for 10,000 years, which shouldn't be.

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    • I mean... Raava came back fairly quickly (a few minutes). Just seems a bit unfair that Vaatu doesn't get equal treatment.

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    • CloudTemplar wrote:

      AvatarLance wrote:


      CloudTemplar wrote:
      I think we're all missing a rather important point here; where's Vaatu? I was left under the impression he was destroyed by Korra with her purification-style waterbending, but Raava herself claimed that 'one cannot exist without the other'. It's all very nice that it works conviniantely for the good guys and Raava gets reborn inside Vaatu with Jinora's help, but why doesn't that work the other way around? 

      All I'm trying to say here really is that according to all laws of logic and balance, if Vaatu got destroyed- as opposed to getting sealed away again- so should have been Raava.


      Vaatu is now inside Raava, and after 10,000 years, at the next HC, he will come out again and the battle between good and evil will have to take place once again to decide the fate of the next 10,000 years after that (unless the Avatar finds a way to prevent HC from happening and locking Vaatu away again for the enxt 10,000 years)
      And until then the spirit of evil and darkness and chaos won't exist? Where's the balance in that? If you're right, light will exist without the presence of darkness for 10,000 years, which shouldn't be.

      If you have watched book 2 you should know that the defeated one will be absorbed into victorious one and eventually re-emerge at the next HC so the battle can be refought.

      Vaatu is now inside Raava, slowly growing inside her over the course of the next 10,000 years until he eventually re-emerges out of Raava again in time for the next HC.

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    • In ATLA Roku said: In avatar state combine the knowledge and strenght of all the past Avatar... But at the end of the episode Korra siad, she lost her connection to her past lifes. So when she enter the avatar state she won't be so strong like before ?? I don't understand.

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    • That's why I said that Raava came back in a few minutes, it didn't take her 10,000 years even though Vaatu defeated her. Seems a bit too convenient is all.

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    • CloudTemplar wrote:
      I mean... Raava came back fairly quickly (a few minutes). Just seems a bit unfair that Vaatu doesn't get equal treatment.


      Well, that's just because Korra went and pulled her out of Unalaq/Vaatu, 10,000 years too soon lol

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    • But that's speculation- in my opinion, not enough is explained after this fight; not how Jinora found Raava's light in the spirit world and not what happened to Vaatu (because I still think she did something to him with the purifying waterbending). Too much still feels open to me after this, which is why I'm looking foreward to Books 3 & 4 so much!

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    • Jinora didn't find Raava's light in the spirit world. It was already in Vaatu/Unalaq, Jinora just showed it to Korra so Korra knew where she had to reach to grab it, or something like that. So Korra dove in grabbed Raava from within Vaatu/Unalaq and revived her 10,000 years early xD

      I'm looking forward to the next seasons too, here's hoping it won't take a year.

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    • No she suddenly showed up after telling her father she needed to help Korra with the light in her hands, put it inside Unalatu for Korra to grab and went off again back to her body. 

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    • CloudTemplar wrote:
      No she suddenly showed up after telling her father she needed to help Korra with the light in her hands, put it inside Unalatu for Korra to grab and went off again back to her body. 


      It isn't Jinora's god-given duty to put the defeated spirit back into the victorious one, it just happens by itself. Where did you get that's what happened?

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    • Nobody said anything about duty. In the Godzilla-like fight off the shore of republic city Korra put her hand on Unalatu's chest and he said 'you're looking for something that's not there'. Thsi statment lead me to believe Raava wasn't inside him, but elsewhere in the spirit world, and then Jinora shows up all glowing, with the sourse of her glow quite clearly in her arms, not to mantion the caption on the pic in the wikia says "Jinora brings Raava's light back into the world "

      So that's just got me a bit confused with how the creators thought this through. 

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    • Jenora brings Raava's light back int othe world, you shouldn't take that literally. And it's not written by the creators of the series.

      Vaatu saying 'you're looking for something that's not there' is just him being ignorant, well that's what i believe anyway.

      The defeated spirit reincarnating inside the victorious one has always been an automatic process, so why would it have been any different this time around?

      Don't get me wrong, I understand where the confusion comes from.

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    • I think it was more like Jenora showed Korra the light in the dark. Its more metaphorical

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    • YoraeKaiser wrote:
      Brilam wrote:

      I think it's just because Raava and Vaatu have a really strong connection to each other.

      Intelligence4 wrote:

      but that bond was broken, and raava and wan supposably became one.

      Yup. Here's the problem, lack of consistency: Raava and Wan fused to become a new entity, the Avatar Spirit. This much has been established. That's even the reason why Unalaq dies in the end; he was fused with Vaatu so that when Korra did the spirit conversion plot power, she destroyed Vaatu AND Unalaq.

      Remember her speech to the twins? Vaatu and Unalaq weren't fused for even a complete day and he was already beyond the point where "CTRL+Z" was a possibility.

      And then Vaatu can rip Raava, who's been fused with Wan as the Avatar Spirit long enough to have a whole temple full of statues dedicated to them? Just like that, blink of an eye?

      the difference between unalaq and korra is this. unalaq's bond with vaatu made him a true monster, not truly human anymore. korra's bond with raava leaves her sitll a human being. thus unalaq would have access to attributes that korra does not have. not to mention that just because someone is bonded Forever, does not mean that bond is unbreakable. it means it is ever lasting, not indestructible. and for hwatever bond the avatar and raava have, the bond between Vaatu and raava is moer powerful.

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    • Heyheyheyy22 wrote:
      I think it was more like Jenora showed Korra the light in the dark. Its more metaphorical


      Exactly.

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    • AvatarLance wrote:
      Heyheyheyy22 wrote:
      I think it was more like Jenora showed Korra the light in the dark. Its more metaphorical

      Exactly.

      the spirit world is a place where metaphor becomes flesh after all. could simply be the light only itnerrupted vaatu and revealed where Raava was inside of him, or perhaps 'woke her up' as she would eventaulyl be reborn. this allowed korra to strike and extract the spirit, weakening vaatu as his alternate returned to the world.

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    • Thorondragon wrote:
      AvatarLance wrote:
      Heyheyheyy22 wrote:
      I think it was more like Jenora showed Korra the light in the dark. Its more metaphorical

      Exactly.
      the spirit world is a place where metaphor becomes flesh after all. could simply be the light only itnerrupted vaatu and revealed where Raava was inside of him, or perhaps 'woke her up' as she would eventaulyl be reborn. this allowed korra to strike and extract the spirit, weakening vaatu as his alternate returned to the world.

      Yeah, well, that's also true, but there was a metaphorical side to it nonetheless.

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    • CloudTemplar wrote:
      I mean... Raava came back fairly quickly (a few minutes). Just seems a bit unfair that Vaatu doesn't get equal treatment.


      that is because raava had help from janora and it was during the hc wich gives enough power to raava to escape with the help from janora and korra who both used there spirits so raava could be reborn

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    • CloudTemplar wrote:
      That's why I said that Raava came back in a few minutes, it didn't take her 10,000 years even though Vaatu defeated her. Seems a bit too convenient is all.


      also hc didn't end at the time which aloud korra and janora to bring her back

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    • Englishandy wrote:
      CloudTemplar wrote:
      I mean... Raava came back fairly quickly (a few minutes). Just seems a bit unfair that Vaatu doesn't get equal treatment.

      that is because raava had help from janora and it was during the hc wich gives enough power to raava to escape with the help from janora and korra who both used there spirits so raava could be reborn


      Raava would be reborn out of Vaatu anyway, Korra just sped up the process by yanking Raava out of Vaatu herself instead of waiting 10,000 years until it would happen automatically.

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    • If that's the case, couldn't someone just yank out Vaatu from the Avatar?

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    • That is the case, you even saw it happening on screen!

      Raava could pull Vaatu out of Unalaq possibly, like Vaatu pulled Raava out of Korra. We'll never know.

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    • If you knew where Vaatu was in Korra, you could pull him out. Some kind of dark anti-jinora?

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    • Oh, you mean removing Vaatu from Raava within Korra? Well, I guess she just hasn't even stopped to realize yet that Vaatu is now inside of her.

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    • Just takes some villain with that knowledge to do it. Maybe Koh knows about it?

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    • Korra should know though that Vaatu is now inside of her. She just hasn't thought about that yet. Let her enjoy her victory for a bit first before thinking about Vaatu again lol

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    • No, the description of the episode states that Korra may have found a way to defeat Vaatu forever, and it's most likely the case that the pacification technique can brighten or darken a spirit permanently, and that Korra using the pacification technique on Vaatu made him dissipate into the light forever, and Korra herself told Vaatu to go in peace. Korra didn't physically or spiritually bond with Vaatu, she made him disappear altogether. For Korra to have the ability to turn Vaatu, the embodiment of evil, chaos, and darkness, into nothing, is extremely powerful.

      If somehow Vaatu emerges once more, the Avatar facing him would easily be able to use the pacification technique to get rid of him.

      However, I firmly believe Vaatu is gone forever.

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    • I don't know if I'd necessarily trust that. Episode descriptions are notoriously prone to error, & besides, we already got the "defeat you forever" line from Vaatu, & that turned out to be false.

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    • Johnmarkpirring wrote: No, the description of the episode states that Korra may have found a way to defeat Vaatu forever, and it's most likely the case that the pacification technique can brighten or darken a spirit permanently, and that Korra using the pacification technique on Vaatu made him dissipate into the light forever, and Korra herself told Vaatu to go in peace. Korra didn't physically or spiritually bond with Vaatu, she made him disappear altogether. For Korra to have the ability to turn Vaatu, the embodiment of evil, chaos, and darkness, into nothing, is extremely powerful.

      If somehow Vaatu emerges once more, the Avatar facing him would easily be able to use the pacification technique to get rid of him.

      However, I firmly believe Vaatu is gone forever.

      But we saw Raava dissipate into the same light dust, and she was reborn inside Vaatu, therefore wouldn't it work the same way the other way round? Likewise Unalaq didn't physically bond with Raava but she still was reborn inside him/Vaatu

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    • Yes, Vaatu will gradually reform within Raava over the course of the next 10,000 years.

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    • I do have one question though. Is there any possiblity at all that, rather than being absorbed by Korra and Raava, Vaatu and Unalaq were "killed" by Korra's technique (Vaatu not actually dying persay since he can come back but disappearing for the time being), making it possible for there to be some kind of reincarnation like with the normal avatar? I'd say this is probably unlikely, as Unalaq was in the "Dark Avatar States" when he was defeated, so most likely any cycle was broken. And, according to many, the defeated spirit is reborn again inside the victorious one to eventually rise again. But I'm curious as to what others think (if this question has already been addressed I apologize)

      Either way, I think it can be agreed by everyone that the ending of season 2 was not super concrete.

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    • Well, you practically answered your own question - Vaatalq was killed in the Avatar State, so the cycle was broken before it had even begun.

      And, it isn't just 'according to many' that the defeated spirit is reborn inside the victorious one - it's a fact established in the show itself.

      I understand where you come from, though. However, if you stop to think for a minute, you will realize that Vaatu can't be gone or 'destroyed' forever. According to the show itself, one cannot exist without the other. Since Raava is still alive, this means Vaatu must be too, as one cannot exist without the other.

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    • I think that Vaatu and Raava are two entities that allow the avatar world to exist, without them their worlds will cease to exist.

      That's why I think none of them can be permanently detroyed as long as their world and  their universe exist. Esssentially Raava and Vaatu are immortal as long as the universe they exist in is there. So only their spiritual forms are destrroyed if they die, their essence and memories are preserved and immortal, that's why Vaatu like Raava can reborn within each other. I think that Raava and Vaatu might even be the gods of the Avatar world, because of the way they are described and the vast powers they have.

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    • There's no indication of that. They come from the spirit realm so physical realm laws could be different. It was Vaatu himself who created the portals so there's some kind of difference. As for Vaatu being "killed" and reincarnated, we have to just see.

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    • Kubernes wrote:
      There's no indication of that. They come from the spirit realm so physical realm laws could be different. It was Vaatu himself who created the portals so there's some kind of difference.

      What are you referring to here?

      As for Vaatu being "killed" and reincarnated, we have to just see.

      Well Unalaq-Vaatu won't be reincarnated because he was killed in the 'Dark Avatar State', thus breaking the cycle before it even begun.

      Vaatu, however, will be reborn from within Raava.

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    • I take it from all the differences between the two realms that we've seen.

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    • I mean, there's no indication of what?

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    • I think maybe that Vaatu and Raava are the creators of the avatar universe, maybe we will get some information about that in book 3 and book 4 in the next coming year, if the show is not cancelled because of low ratings.

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    • Things like people being able to survive in the spirit world, unaged, for decades and others just flat out dying. Distance seems to be different too between the worlds.

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    • AvatarLance wrote:
      Well, you practically answered your own question - Vaatalq was killed in the Avatar State, so the cycle was broken before it had even begun.

      And, it isn't just 'according to many' that the defeated spirit is reborn inside the victorious one - it's a fact established in the show itself.

      I understand where you come from, though. However, if you stop to think for a minute, you will realize that Vaatu can't be gone or 'destroyed' forever. According to the show itself, one cannot exist without the other. Since Raava is still alive, this means Vaatu must be too, as one cannot exist without the other.

      I said "as many have stated" many to cover myself in case I misheard cause this thread has gone off in several directions. But yes thanks for restating all that so I have a more concrete summary of whats been discussed.

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    • Kubernes wrote:
      Things like people being able to survive in the spirit world, unaged, for decades and others just flat out dying. Distance seems to be different too between the worlds.


      Well, the people in the SW who don't age don't because they are there in spirit, not physically, so they're just like the other spirits.

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    • The case of a defeated spirit being reborn in another seems to only be with Vaatu/Raava. I don't know if i'd say it happens with others.

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    • Well there are bound to be other spirits that are also natural opposites like Vaatu and Raava.

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    • Im actually ok with the dark avatar now because it wasnt the same as the one in my fanfiction. Mine is called the Antipode, and it can't bend the four bending elements. It has control over the four elements oposite of bending, called breaking. They are Destruction, Decay, Attraction, and Poison. Also, when it goes into the Antipode State, its eyes glow black, and instead of protecting the four nations, it protects the four breaker nations on the opposite side of the world.

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    • I must say though, there were a few things I wasn't able to comprehend: how was korra able to learn energybending in practicaly five seconds? How was Jinora able to revive Raava? How was it possible for Vaatu to rip Raava out of Korra's body? And why does The fight between Korra and Unalaq in Republic City remind me of Godzilla and King Kong fighting to the death in Tokyo City? XD lol

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    • Jinora didn't revive Raava, she just showed Korra where Raava was inside of Vaatalaq, she showed Korra 'the light in the dark."

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    • Also, I've just realized something. Raava is now back inside of Korra and the Avatar cycle can continue. In the last episode of Book Two, Korra destroys Vaatu, and because Raava and Vaatu are light and dark and one cannot be withput the other, Vaatu will slowly grow back inside of Raava over the course of 10,000 years. Raava is inside of the Avatar, which means Vaatu will grow inside of the Avatar. What does that meen for the Avatar in 10,000 years? Vaatu's spirit of darkness will probably infect him/her in some sort of way,which could cause all sorts of problems.

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    • The Avatar Cycle does not continue, it has been reset and restarted. The link to all previous Avatar incarnation has been forever lost. Korra is now the new first Avatar, the last Avatar of the old cycle and the first Avatar of the new cycle.

      We'll see what effects it will have on the Avatar, if any. Maybe it won't have any ill effects on the Avatar and Vaatu will just re-emerge out of them 10,000 into the future in time for the next HC.

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    • It would be better if they showed how Jinora was able to do that is what people might want.

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    • Vaatu's power must have been greatly enhanced because more sprits were drawn into darkness.

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    • Interesting that Raava couldn't influence any.

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    • Have you seen Unalaq's skill? He's no push over. He's had years to master water bending and spiritual techniques while Korra is only 17-18 years old with no where near as much experience. Naturally Unalaq would give Korra a lot of trouble. 

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    • 17-18 years plus a few thousand years of experience at her disposal. But yes, hes no pushover.

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    • In her Avatar state yes, but yes she did use it for a large portion of the fight so disregard that XD.

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    • ThePrinceOfFire wrote: Have you seen Unalaq's skill? He's no push over. He's had years to master water bending and spiritual techniques while Korra is only 17-18 years old with no where near as much experience. Naturally Unalaq would give Korra a lot of trouble. 

      Despite the amount of power Vaatu gave to him, He would of been completely screwed had their battle taken place int the desert

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    • Does anyone know why Raava refused with Korra. She had returned to full strength and the glance had been restored. There was no longer any reason for her to join with Korra. Why would she voluntarily restrain herself. it can also be argued that she is stronger when her and Korra are together. In fact, she is stronger. Remember, Vaatu at his full size was no match for Wan and Raava once they combined fully, in the Avatar State. Although, it was never really explained on the show how the whole Korra/Wan and Raava union works. What happens to Raava's spirit once she joins with Korra. Does Raava's essence lay dormant, deep within Korra's soul. From what we've been shown so far, this would be the most likely. can Raava control korra if she wanted to. It can be argued that when any Avatar enters the AS (continuous) that Raava is in control. Does Raava see and hear everything Korra sees and hears. Or Instead of looking at Korra and Raava as to seperetly entities, they should be viewed as one entity, because that is what they are. That much is conformed. MOST IMportantly, why dosent she communicte with korra more often, or with any other present Avatar. it was proven that they can talk to each other, when she motivated Korra, just before Unavaatu was about to crush Korra to Death. It's like when she fused with Wan, after they defeated Vaatu and Wan closed the spirt Portals, Raava sort of dissapeared. Even at the end, before wan took his last breath, it was unclear whether or not Wan actually heard Raava's statement about her being with him forever.

      Another thing that dosent add up either is that, if Raava can talk to korra, why didnt she warn Korra about not opening the spirit portals, telling wan's story earlier. Raava's input could definetly of helped Korra a little when she was fighting Unavatuu. After all who else but Raava would know Vaatu's strengths and weakness better than her. They were stuck in a battle together for 10,000 years. But maybe that is too much to ask for. Another example of when Raava's input could of been useful is when Aang was lost, and wa struggling with what action he would take to stop Ozai. Why didnt she talk to Aang? At the time, it wouldn't of mattered because Aang had Roku and his past lives to call upon for help, but Wan never had past lives.

      Overall, I think it should of just been explained further about Raaava and Wan/Korra's fusion, and how the 'Avatar spirit' works. What do you guys think

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    • Books 3 and 4 told Raava to do it.

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    • Kubernes wrote:
      Interesting that Raava couldn't influence any.


      She could. Raava's presence would have reverted dark spirits to normal.

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    • AvatarReiko wrote:
      Does anyone know why Raava refused with Korra. She had returned to full strength and the glance had been restored. There was no longer any reason for her to join with Korra. Why would she voluntarily restrain herself. it can also be argued that she is stronger when her and Korra are together. In fact, she is stronger. Remember, Vaatu at his full size was no match for Wan and Raava once they combined fully, in the Avatar State. Although, it was never really explained on the show how the whole Korra/Wan and Raava union works. What happens to Raava's spirit once she joins with Korra. Does Raava's essence lay dormant, deep within Korra's soul. From what we've been shown so far, this would be the most likely. can Raava control korra if she wanted to. It can be argued that when any Avatar enters the AS (continuous) that Raava is in control. Does Raava see and hear everything Korra sees and hears. Or Instead of looking at Korra and Raava as to seperetly entities, they should be viewed as one entity, because that is what they are. That much is conformed. MOST IMportantly, why dosent she communicte with korra more often, or with any other present Avatar. it was proven that they can talk to each other, when she motivated Korra, just before Unavaatu was about to crush Korra to Death. It's like when she fused with Wan, after they defeated Vaatu and Wan closed the spirt Portals, Raava sort of dissapeared. Even at the end, before wan took his last breath, it was unclear whether or not Wan actually heard Raava's statement about her being with him forever.

      Another thing that dosent add up either is that, if Raava can talk to korra, why didnt she warn Korra about not opening the spirit portals, telling wan's story earlier. Raava's input could definetly of helped Korra a little when she was fighting Unavatuu. After all who else but Raava would know Vaatu's strengths and weakness better than her. They were stuck in a battle together for 10,000 years. But maybe that is too much to ask for. Another example of when Raava's input could of been useful is when Aang was lost, and wa struggling with what action he would take to stop Ozai. Why didnt she talk to Aang? At the time, it wouldn't of mattered because Aang had Roku and his past lives to call upon for help, but Wan never had past lives.

      Overall, I think it should of just been explained further about Raaava and Wan/Korra's fusion, and how the 'Avatar spirit' works. What do you guys think

      You have some pretty good question there.

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    • Their fight needs more destruction and awesomeness. Hope they do that in Book 3.

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    • Warmachine375 wrote:
      Their fight needs more destruction and awesomeness. Hope they do that in Book 3.

      That's usually the oppsite of what makes a fight better. Remember the "fight" in The Empire Strikes Back between Vader and Luke. It was great because of what was leading up to rather than the fight itself. Luke wasn't able to really fight Vader and lost rather easily.

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    • Here is what could have happened instead:

      Instead of ripping Raava out of Korra and 'de-avatarizing' her, Unavaatu could have just morphed into this giant monster form right away. Like that, Korra would find herself unable to even lay a scratch on Unavaatu. Satisfied, thinking the Avatar of no threat to him anymore, Unavaatu just ditches Korra and travels to RC to lay siege to the city. Tenzin tells Korra about the Tree of Time. Following Tenzin's advice, Korra meditates in the tree, connecting to the great cosmic energy of the universe (and possibly energybending in there somewhere as well), growing to a giant astral/cosmic/or whatever version of the Avatar. She travels back to RC to engage the evil Unavaatu once more. And the rest is history.

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    • So everything happens the same, it's just that the Avatar State is spared? I'm not really sold. There's a lot that doesn't make sense about that whole sequence, but at least how Unavaatu turned into a giant when Korra couldn't isn't one of them--the Avatar had never destroyed Vaatu during a Harmonic Convergence before. This would just retain everything that didn't make sense, & dig a hole where there was once a relatively good explanation.

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    • Kubernes wrote:
      Warmachine375 wrote:
      Their fight needs more destruction and awesomeness. Hope they do that in Book 3.
      That's usually the oppsite of what makes a fight better. Remember the "fight" in The Empire Strikes Back between Vader and Luke. It was great because of what was leading up to rather than the fight itself. Luke wasn't able to really fight Vader and lost rather easily.

      I was talking about when both Avatars of light and dark clash, the surrounding area in their fight would be massive collateral damage!

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    • Neo Bahamut wrote:
      So everything happens the same, it's just that the Avatar State is spared? I'm not really sold. There's a lot that doesn't make sense about that whole sequence, but at least how Unavaatu turned into a giant when Korra couldn't isn't one of them--the Avatar had never destroyed Vaatu during a Harmonic Convergence before. This would just retain everything that didn't make sense, & dig a hole where there was once a relatively good explanation.

      I didn't say Korra would just turn into a giant the same way as Unavaatu, just like that. She would still do it the same way by meditating in the tree of time and connecting to the cosmic energy of the universe, like she actually did. So yeah everything happens the same, just that she would still be the Avatar and have Raava's power at her disposal. Think about it.

      What would be more realistic; Korra defeating Unavaatu in the Dark Avatar State as an astral projection of her regular, de-avatarized and de-Raavad self, or defeating him as an astral projection of her Avatar self?

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    • She defeats him with the purification technique. Doesn't really matter how powerful he is.

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    • Neo Bahamut wrote:
      She defeats him with the purification technique. Doesn't really matter how powerful he is.

      It does. Remeber that the purification technique does work if you're at least as powerful as the spirit your purifying. At least that's what I understood from it.

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    • It probably has more to do with having perfected the technique. The power of a Spirit isn't something you can really measure in most cases, & in any case the Avatar can easily overpower Vaatu at full strength.

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    • But that's the thing, Korra wasn't the Avatar when she did it, she she didn't have Raava's power anymore, while Unavaatu did have Vaatu's power + was in the Dark Avatar State at the moment.

      Yes, your skill in the technique is important. And I guess also your willpower should be stronger than the spirit.

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    • AvatarLance wrote:

      Yes, your skill in the technique is important. And I guess also your willpower should be stronger than the spirit.
      

      Yes, I agree, that is precisely why Korra failed in an attempt to use the purification technique on the Dark Spirit in 'peacekeepers' whilst she fought Desna and Eska.

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    • That scene were the giant dark spirit shows up to eat Korra is still a bit odd. I guess Unalaq didn't have control over all the dark spirits that we see him having later on?

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    • what should have changed was vaatu ripping raava out: that broke the rules of being an avatar, they are supposed to be "one", so how can the avatar spirit pop out whenever it's convenient? that and the giant spirit fight. it would have been just as epic, if not more so, if the two of them had stayed in the spirit world, or even ventured in and out of the north and south poles every now and then, and just duked it out with normal bending and all. that what we avatards are all about, isn't it? bending? so then they could have saved the part where unalaq crushes her for the end, and had raava talk to her as a huge inspiration thing where she connects with raava, and then she pops out and does the whole you cannot win thing, and wins.

      they could even have had unalaq die and get reincarnated and save him for a future episode or something. but considering that they want a new villain for each season, korra should have just energybent unalaq to remove vaatu, and then locked him away, and closed the portals so that he can't escape.

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    • Avatar Minato wrote:
      What are you talking about?! If you watched the final four episodes you would know something. Go on Nickelodeon website right now and watch the final two episodes that were put up at midnight

      thank you. learn about ur topic before starting a group genius.

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    • Ezvil wrote:
      I myself was a bit surprised that Korra+Raava vs. Unalaq and Vaatu initially ended with the dark side winning, as I thought it was evidenced earlier that Korra was a better bender than Unalaq (didnt she beat him pretty handly when they were in the prison looking for Tonraq? and she was not even using the avatar state). However, the only reason I could see the result we saw happening is Vaatu is in fact alot more powerful than Raava, as Wan and Raava even together struggled immensely to defeat him alone (although wasnt he so powerful because it was the time of darkness or something along those lines?). With the addition of Unalaq's talent in bending, I guess it could have been enough to enable him to beat Korra and Braava initially.

      As for Korra's past lives, I am surprised they didnt play a bigger role, as is has been evidenced several times that even expert "mono" benders stand no chance against someone with multiple elemental mastery (Aang holding his own relatively well against Ozai even before using the avatar state and then winning handely with it). This I would think would give Korra and Raava the edge over Unalaq and Vaatu, but I guess if Vaatu is still that powerful then the match would be even, thus making it possible for the initial outcome we saw.

      If you remember the episode correctly before unalaq and vattu fused. korra was kicking vattus ass. she kept beating the shit out of him like a thousand times and almost put him back into his place until unalaq came. The problem with unalaq and vattu is that unulaqs spiritual side is 10x stronger than korra's so he is able to take full advantage of a spirit assisting him in the fight, where as korra just feels herslelf glowing and says lets kick some ass. even with only 1 element its easier for vattu and unulaq cuz they are more inline and aware of eachothers capabilities. therefore acting more like a team rather then a human with glowy eyes. Vattu had alot of presence even when inside unalaq cuz unalaq let him control him too. which adds to their strength.

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    • AvatarLance
      AvatarLance removed this reply because:
      After posting I realized this wasn't a proper reply.
      23:48, November 20, 2013
      This reply has been removed
      Intelligence4 wrote:
      what should have changed was vaatu ripping raava out: that broke the rules of being an avatar, they are supposed to be "one", so how can the avatar spirit pop out whenever it's convenient? that and the giant spirit fight. it would have been just as epic, if not more so, if the two of them had stayed in the spirit world, or even ventured in and out of the north and south poles every now and then, and just duked it out with normal bending and all. that what we avatards are all about, isn't it? bending? so then they could have saved the part where unalaq crushes her for the end, and had raava talk to her as a huge inspiration thing where she connects with raava, and then she pops out and does the whole you cannot win thing, and wins.

      they could even have had unalaq die and get reincarnated and save him for a future episode or something. but considering that they want a new villain for each season, korra should have just energybent unalaq to remove vaatu, and then locked him away, and closed the portals so that he can't escape.

      As I posted earlier,
      Instead of ripping Raava out of Korra and 'de-avatarizing' her, Unavaatu could have just morphed into this giant monster form right away. Like that, Korra would find herself unable to even lay a scratch on Unavaatu. Satisfied, thinking the Avatar of no threat to him anymore, Unavaatu just ditches Korra and travels to RC to lay siege to the city. Tenzin tells Korra about the Tree of Time. Following Tenzin's advice, Korra meditates in the tree, connecting to the great cosmic energy of the universe (and possibly energybending in there somewhere as well), growing to a giant astral/cosmic/or whatever version of the Avatar. She travels back to RC to engage the evil Unavaatu once more. And the rest is history.

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    • I don't think it has anything to do with spiritality but rather the human potential.

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    • ^Thats a really good theory, I initially didnt consider Unalaq's spiritual side having that much of an impact on the fight, but it really makes a lot of sense the way you put it. It makes a lot more sense than just "Vaatu was more powerful" thing, especially since if that were the case, Vaatu would have broke free of Raava a long time ago.

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    • Maybe Vaatu should have used the Tree of Time to view his past mistakes? Did you notice that we never learn how the two learned about each other?

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    • Kubernes wrote:
      Maybe Vaatu should have used the Tree of Time to view his past mistakes? Did you notice that we never learn how the two learned about each other?

      Great he might end up like Kurama who used to antagonize Naruto but in the end he grew friendly and teamed up with him and if Vaatu and Raava are inside Korra antagonizing each other from within until they put aside their differences as the unlikely trio might work together when facing a common enemy which neither of them can handle alone for the common good just as Naruto and Kurama did. Now that's true balance.

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    • AvatarLance wrote:
      Intelligence4 wrote:
      what should have changed was vaatu ripping raava out: that broke the rules of being an avatar, they are supposed to be "one", so how can the avatar spirit pop out whenever it's convenient? that and the giant spirit fight. it would have been just as epic, if not more so, if the two of them had stayed in the spirit world, or even ventured in and out of the north and south poles every now and then, and just duked it out with normal bending and all. that what we avatards are all about, isn't it? bending? so then they could have saved the part where unalaq crushes her for the end, and had raava talk to her as a huge inspiration thing where she connects with raava, and then she pops out and does the whole you cannot win thing, and wins.

      they could even have had unalaq die and get reincarnated and save him for a future episode or something. but considering that they want a new villain for each season, korra should have just energybent unalaq to remove vaatu, and then locked him away, and closed the portals so that he can't escape.

      As I posted earlier,
      Instead of ripping Raava out of Korra and 'de-avatarizing' her, Unavaatu could have just morphed into this giant monster form right away. Like that, Korra would find herself unable to even lay a scratch on Unavaatu. Satisfied, thinking the Avatar of no threat to him anymore, Unavaatu just ditches Korra and travels to RC to lay siege to the city. Tenzin tells Korra about the Tree of Time. Following Tenzin's advice, Korra meditates in the tree, connecting to the great cosmic energy of the universe (and possibly energybending in there somewhere as well), growing to a giant astral/cosmic/or whatever version of the Avatar. She travels back to RC to engage the evil Unavaatu once more. And the rest is history.

      I aggree that ripping raava out was unneccary, made no sense, and to be honest it looked like vattu was sucking on her face (looked so gayyy) so yea that part was screwed up. and also i would choose a bending battle over giants playing arm wrestling anyday.

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    • The fight kindof reminds me of the Obi-Wan/Anakin fight from Episode III: it went on alittle too long and almost to the point of self gratification. The fight could have lasted 3 minutes and still have depth to it.

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    • they should have just stuck to an all-out bending battle. that's what's so great about avatar - the elemental manipulation. it's actually what got me hooked on the show in the first place. if we wanted to see some giant spirits duke it out, we'd pick another show to watch. they could have at least incorporated bending into the battle in some bigger way than they did.

      that should have changed and of course the past lives thing: we're only watching korra b/c of atla, so why get rid of all links to the show like that? stupid move really...unless it makes for some epic way to get them back.

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    • Well it makes sense now why the show is just called 'The Legend of Korra'.

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    • Ezvil wrote:
      ^Thats a really good theory, I initially didnt consider Unalaq's spiritual side having that much of an impact on the fight, but it really makes a lot of sense the way you put it. It makes a lot more sense than just "Vaatu was more powerful" thing, especially since if that were the case, Vaatu would have broke free of Raava a long time ago.

      Well, at the time of the battle between Korra and Vaatu/Unavaatu, Vaatu was stronger than Raava, because when Raava fused with Wan to form the Avatar, Raava was very small and weaker then normal while Vaatu had become bigger and stronger. So Korra had a smaller and weaker Raava inside of her while Unalaq had the bigger and stronger Vaatu inside of him. Now though, when Raava re-fused with Korra at the end of book 2, she had regained her original, full size and full power (while Vaatu is now the small and weak one, gradually growing back to power in Raava until the next HC), so the Avatar is now stronger than ever before.

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    • So that's why it's called Legend of Korra for a reason.

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    • AvatarLance wrote: But that's the thing, Korra wasn't the Avatar when she did it, she she didn't have Raava's power anymore, while Unavaatu did have Vaatu's power + was in the Dark Avatar State at the moment.

      Yes, your skill in the technique is important. And I guess also your willpower should be stronger than the spirit.

      But Korra WAS the Avatar every OTHER time she attempted the technique. To suggest that every generic Dark Spirit was stronger than her, & that's why she couldn't purify them, is pretty far-fetched. The obvious solution, then, is that once you master the technique, it will usually work, although it may be possible for a Spirit to physically break out of it.

      "that should have changed and of course the past lives thing: we're only watching korra b/c of atla, so why get rid of all links to the show like that? stupid move really...unless it makes for some epic way to get them back."

      Speak for yourself. Some of us are not married to nostalgia.

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    • Neo Bahamut wrote:

      AvatarLance wrote: But that's the thing, Korra wasn't the Avatar when she did it, she she didn't have Raava's power anymore, while Unavaatu did have Vaatu's power + was in the Dark Avatar State at the moment.

      Yes, your skill in the technique is important. And I guess also your willpower should be stronger than the spirit.

      But Korra WAS the Avatar every OTHER time she attempted the technique. To suggest that every generic Dark Spirit was stronger than her, & that's why she couldn't purify them, is pretty far-fetched. The obvious solution, then, is that once you master the technique, it will usually work, although it may be possible for a Spirit to physically break out of it.

      "that should have changed and of course the past lives thing: we're only watching korra b/c of atla, so why get rid of all links to the show like that? stupid move really...unless it makes for some epic way to get them back."

      Speak for yourself. Some of us are not married to nostalgia.

      I'm not suggesting the dark spirits Korra attempted to purify were stronger than her. I'm guessing it's more to do with willpower and keeping focus.

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    • Maybe, but I think it was just technique. Remember the first time Korra attempt it? It almost looked like she screwed up & tried to freeze the Spirit solid.

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    • Of course, if the technique isn't good. You must do it right.

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    • Maybe Korra can only do it when the plot wants her to?

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    • I don't think that's really a fair statement. Korra's spirit purification technique progresses in a very linear fashion throughout the Book. First it's obviously wrong & doesn't come close to working. Then it very nearly works, but just doesn't make it. Every subsequent time, she succeeds. It's not as though it works or fails randomly.

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    • If she was able to purify that giant water spirit then she wouldn't have lost her memories and see what the first avatar went through? I guess that's why dark spirits do when they eat you?

      That dark spirit wasn't really explained. I guess Unalaq sent it with the twins but they certainly seemed surprised it showed up. Maybe Vaatu sent it?

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    • Unalaq & probably Vaatu didn't have control over that one for some unexplained reason. I don't think it actually ate Korra, I think it was somehow driven off off-screen, but not without infecting her with its essence.

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    • i don't think unalaq or vaatu were really controlling the dark spirits per se, but just influencing them to turn dark, and they still had their own free will. they just choose to aid unalaq and vaatu b/c they knew that they were "on their side" or something. also look at the spirit bumi charmed with his flute: it returned to the light willingly on it's own, and without any outside influences.

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    • As I mentioned in another thread:

      • Aye-Aye was turned dark by Vaatu. After being briefly turned back, he expressed no conscious awareness of his actions during that state.
      • Furryfoot turned dark despite having literally no reason to. After this, he did everything that Unalaq said, even if it meant harming his good friend.

      The Dark Spirits do not have free will, at least not the ones that Unalaq is shown ordering around. The Spirit that Bumi charmed just happened to be able to be reached by music, it isn't the case that it chose to go back to normal. In fact, I'm not sure if it fully reverted, as it still looked very much like a Dark Spirit.

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    • I guess he had power over all but that one spirit?

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    • I would just call this a screw up.

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    • You know, Aye-Aye might not have cared that he killed some of those humans. Remember the one he changed earlier? That guy dies too. Yes, Aye-Aye says he could have straight up killed him by remaining in him longer but the guy still dies by something else in the spirit wilds.

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    • Maybe he'll show up in Book 3 and if he sees Korra and say: "Oh you must be Stinky's new incarnation! I will call you Stinky Girl." Korra might say: "Haha, very funny, the name is Korra." but Aye-aye will say: "Stinky Girl is more accurate". Then Korra facepalmed in frustration! LOL

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    • I completely agree. Korra should have easily won!

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    • Vatuus spirit has become alot more powerful than Ravaas though due to Wans mistake, so the dark Avatar was granted far superior power than Korra and defeated her

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    • 207.46.13.69
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