FANDOM


Skip to table of contents

This is the talk page for the article "Zuko".

  • This space is for discussing changes to the article. Discussion on changing an infobox image or profile quote takes place on the appropriate project page for each. General discussion about the subject belongs to the comments, forum, or blog posts.
  • Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
  • Please remember to stay civil and sign all of your comments with four tildes (~~~~).

This article is currently rated Featured and A-class on the Avatar Wiki grading system.

Talk page

Is it me or there should be a talk page here? It's not possible that Zuko doesn't have a talk page... Was it lost during a move war? Omnibender 23:28, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Maybe people don't quarrel over Zuko's info? Felinoel 02:55, 22 July 2008 (UTC)


When Zuko was a child was he hit by lightning? At the end of Bitter Work Zuko is shown yelling at a storm as if he was struck by lightning.

What he says:"You've always thrown everything you could at me,well i can take it,and now i can give it back!Come on! Strike me!You've never held back before."

No. What he was referring to was his bad luck in general. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 05:28, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Isn't Aang Zuko's grandfather?

If Zuko's mother's father was the Avatar (Roku), wouldn't that make Aang Zuko's grandfather to some extent? Master Waterbender 08:25, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

He's considered a spiritual relative due to this connection. But they're not physically or genetically related. Puragus - Talk 15:19, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

Plus, Ursa is Roku's granddaughter, not Zuko, he's Roku's great-grandson. Omnibender - Talk 00:07, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

yeah, they are right. while they are related, its only spiritually because hes roku's reincarnation. it's not like aang is roku's child. and its his great grandfather Army grl55 11:54, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

This discussion is closed. The result of this discussion was:
Aang and Zuko are related spiritually
Please do not edit this discussion.

Height

Okay, this question isnt just about Zuko, but about all characters that hav a listed height. Where did people get the information on that character's height? Are people just estimating or was there an actual listed source? Newyorkme22 04:02, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Probably from Nick Magazine articles or those "Lost Scrolls" or some other obscure thing that people who just watch the show for fun won't even hear of Felinoel 05:17, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Oh. really? What are those "Lost Scrolls" that you are talking about?Newyorkme22 05:54, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

From what I have gathered there are five of them, the first four talk about each nation in detail, the fifth talks about the spirit world Felinoel 06:09, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Oh and I assume there is no way to read these lost scrolls right? Newyorkme22 06:12, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Ummm if you buy them or find a not so legal copy online you could read them I guess Felinoel 06:18, 24 July 2008 (UTC)
ah that would make perfect sense! haha thanks! Newyorkme22 06:24, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

These aren't from the Lost Scrolls, I've read them online (though I don't remember where), and they talk just about bending and spirituality regarding bending. I left a message to the person with this Friday as a deadline, if I get no reply about the source, I'm removing the heights. Omnibender 15:14, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

The only height that is canon would be Combustion Man. Scott 15:24, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

I agree. Where are their sources?Fire Lord Phillip 15:28, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

The anon adding to various characters or CM? CM's height was mentioned in an episode commentary on the DVD, we're waiting on the other, if no source is given, we're taking those heights down. Omnibender 16:04, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

What about Nick magazine or the Nick site, I think I remember little bio pages in the Nick magazine... Felinoel 17:41, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

The only thing in the bio pages is their age. Omnibender 17:48, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

I see Felinoel 18:13, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

I remember seeing Toph's info-- including her height (5'1" without the bun, 5'3" with)-- on TV. They were doing a spotlight, or something, but that's all I know. Avatarded 14:00, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

hey um i think i should add that my uncle used to do some of the storyboard writing for the show and the heights that were on the charectar synopsis' were all correct Army grl55 04:11, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

Your input is appreciated. However due to a recent incident, we are hesitant on the written word of being a scriptwriter or being related to one. Untill someone from the Creators of the show reveals the info on a comic con or an official interview, We must be cautious. Thanks anyways. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 12:55, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

Fire Lord Zuko?

Shouldn't it say Fire Lord Zuko like, everywhere on the page?

Unsignedin and proud, --72.183.115.91 00:30, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

No, cause during most of what is described in the page, he wasn't Fire Lord. Omnibender 00:41, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

Plus his name is Zuko, "Fire Lord" is just a title Felinoel 01:28, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Yeah. Zero - Talk 09:25, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

This discussion is closed. The result of this discussion was:
The Article won't be renamed as Fire Lord Zuko
Please do not edit this discussion.

Fire Lord

i never thought zuko would be the fire lord. i thought that aang was the fire lord. if i was azula i would be friends with zuko that way i would not have to be in a mental hospital.

Dude Aang is the Avatar he doesnt need to be the Fire Lord. The Maps of the Avatar world have this written on the Top and the Bottom respectively:

  • People are divided by Four.
  • The World is guided by One.

Or something close to that. The Four are the Four Nations. And the One is the Avatar. Its his job to ensure peace between the Nations. Not rule them. Zero 04:31, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

Everything I was going to say has already been said. Omnibender 22:43, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

This discussion is closed. The result of this discussion was:
Aang was never going to be Fire Lord
Please do not edit this discussion.

Zuko's path question

up to this day i still wonder about this and i need to ask, what exactly made zuko want to join the avatar and defeat the fire lord? I know that there was good and bad within him. was it after he learned about his family history, after the war meeting, after his father lied about fire nation being the best? exactly which part was it, was it like all of a sudden "snapped"? i know for mai betraying azula was he loves zuko more than fear azula, and ty lee finally facing her fear against azula. Fme008 22:49, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Zuko was more his Mother's Son than his Father's and she had raised him well. The revealing of his ancestory and the horrific plan of Ozai combined with the upbringing by Ursa and his honorable spirit to shock him into his senses. It was the combination of all these factors that pursuaded him to finally choose the right path and join the Avatar to defeat the Fire Lord. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 06:51, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

I see it as a combination of two things: Zuko realized that the war was horrific, wrong, and that the Fire Nation's justifications for it, which he had heard his entire life, were a pack of lies. He realized that if he continued to participate in what he knew to be wrong, he would have been lost.

Second, he realized that he would never have the kind of loving relationship from his father that he wanted, and that his dad would only ever appreciate him for what he could accomplish rather than for who he was. Before, he was idolizing a time in his life when his family was happy, and wanted desperately to regain that happiness. He equated pleasing his father with gaining his love and being happy. He eventually learned to let go of that, and severed his failed and abusive relationships with Ozai and Azula.

I realize that doesn't totally answer Fme's question, but it's my opinion as to why exactly Zuko betrayed Ozai. Puragus - Talk 07:41, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Zuko wanted his father to accept him after his shameful scarring, but as time went on he travelled with and without Iroh and gained knowledge of people and the world, the opposite of his father and sister who remained Fire Nation. After making the wrong choice in Ba Sing Se by betraying his uncle the wedge grew deeper in his heart. After the war meeting he probably decided that in fact he couldn't accept his father (not vice versa) while Iroh's revalation to him about Avatar Roku gave him two choices, to follow his father or oppose him. The choice of Combustion Man was a panicky mistake, but by that time Zuko knew that he could no longer follow his father and that Aang was in fact more likely to befriend him than kill him.

Azula was single minded and cruel while Zuko was always mindful and often faced with dilemmas. It proved that it was the latter and not the former who proved stronger. When Zuko removed doubt from his mind he became Azula's equal in decisiveness. User:PhantomS 07:56, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

In other words, It was'nt just one thing, but the combination of Zuko's Entire Life and the experiences he gained throughout it all that made him finally able to do what he did. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 08:33, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Age

Since 1 year has passed since book 1, shouldnt Zuko be 17? Muscleman 23:57, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

This has been discussed befo0re, and the answer is no. There is no evidence that a year had passed since Book 1, Zuko and Aang just said "A year ago", when Aang specifically said he was still frozen in an iceberg. We don't know the birthdays of any of the characters, so we can't say anything for certain. Puragus - Talk 00:22, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

The answer is no. Because it was late 99 AG when Katara and Sokka found Aang. And in the last episode it was in the eight month of 100 AG. So that means that it was less than one year. We dont know his birth day but if he turned 17 at some point that should be mentioned. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ninja72 (wallcontribs) 16:57, September 23, 2015 (UTC)


New image

I put a new image up, because it's spaced upward and gives a basic full body example of Zuko. But, I just want to know if people are okay with it, or if anyone can put up the same image only better quality. --SuperFlash101 21:24, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

I reverted it back, because it's in low quality and only part of a screenshot. If you want a new profile, put some suggestions here, and we can vote, like we did with all the others. Puragus Talk 21:26, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Well didn't you read what I asked? If someone can get the same image only better quality, because it's a perfectly good full-body image. --SuperFlash101 21:29, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Except NO ONE VOTED ON IT. Besides, did you read what I said? That's only part of a screenshot. A higher quality one would be a full screenshot with Zuko being only part of the image.

Besides no one other than you suggested we need a new image. The only reason anyone agreed we needed new images was because we wanted to update everyone's profile to a book three one, but the one we have now is already from book three. Does anyone else think we need a new image? Puragus Talk 21:34, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Alright, so I'll just leave the gallery as it is below. If we decide that we need to change the image, then we'll start attacking the vote area. Energybender 21:48, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

SuperFlash, I should note that in my opinion the best profile images are not the ones that show all of the body, the ones that show only part of the head, or have inadequate clarity or lighting. Showing all of the body just doesn't work, because the head will almost certainly be too small. The ones that show only part of the head make instant recognition of a character more difficult. Do I really need to explain clarity and lighting? 888th Avatar - Talk - Contributions 05:48, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Book 3 image

Here, just wanted to get the gallery started. Energybender 21:41, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

No, see, we need to decide if we need a new profile FIRST. There's no vote yet. Puragus Talk 21:44, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

There's no reason to change the image, the reason we voted for other characters was to have a season 3 image, Zuko's image is season 3 already, alas, no change needed. Also, out of the images put forward, 4 is the one who gives a better face shot (which is what we want, not a full body shot), and has better quality. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:37, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

I haven't decided yet but I'm leaning towards Image 4. 888th Avatar - Talk - Contributions 04:52, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
It seems we are tied with only images 4 and 5. Zukofan123 08:58, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
Even though 5 is a good image, I don't think it should go cause it gives away that Zuko will become Fire Lord, if anyone who is in the course of watching Avatar comes here, it'll be like someone who's in the middle of watching Naruto and finding a page with "Tobi is Madara" near the title. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 14:53, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
Looks like you've made up my mind. 888th Avatar - Talk - Contributions 15:16, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

I see what you mean, but my problem with Image 4 is it's the same one we have right now. It shouldn't even be on the list, we're voting on a new one. And Tobi's Madara!?" What the-! :) lol. --SuperFlash101 15:38, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

The problem here is that there was no problem with Image 4 in the first place. It ticked all the boxes - it was in Season 3, it had his face, it was good quality and had good lighting. This is unlike the other profile pic votes we've been having. Those had earlier images. This one has a Season 3 image. 888th Avatar - Talk - Contributions 15:41, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Most points were mentioned, and also, this is how Zuko looks for the majority of season three, and it doesn't give away the Fire Lord part. --Energybender 18:53, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

If you wanna keep image 4, then why not replace image 1 with image 5 on the Fire Lord Zuko section? Zukofan123 19:29, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

That's a good idea. Replace when the voting is over. 888th Avatar - Talk - Contributions 23:04, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
Then it's settled. Zukofan123 23:22, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
Let's say that the vote will end at the end of tomorrow, January 2. There's no sense keeping it open any longer. 888th Avatar - Talk - Contributions 23:24, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Yeah. Its pretty obvious which one's gonna win. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 08:14, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Duh, number one. So easy... Joey - Talk Contribs 08:36, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Umm. You mean Image 4, don't you? Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 09:16, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Joeyaa: <insertjokehere> Duh, number one. So easy... </insertjokehere> Joey - Talk Contribs 10:22, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

I dont get it. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 16:48, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Funny, that's what I say to my friends when they tell bad jokes, I do it all the time. :) I guess we're more in common than I thought. Joey - Talk Contribs 17:04, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

OK. Now can you explain the joke? Please? Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 17:39, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Perhaps you are looking for wikipedia:Sarcasm? Joey - Talk Contribs 17:56, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Oh. So it was sarcasm. Next time Italic that part. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 18:13, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Nah, next time I'll capitalize, bold, italics, color, and increase font on it... Joey - Talk Contribs 18:51, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Now THATS a joke. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 19:49, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Would it be a joke if I said, "That's what she said" ? Joey - Talk Contribs 20:01, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Votes

Image 1

Image 2

Image 3

Image 4

  1. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:37, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  2. Joey - Talk Contribs 05:55, 1 January 2009 (UTC) (It's a clear shot of him, so perfect in comparison.)
  3. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 08:20, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  4. Waterkai 10:17, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  5. 888th Avatar - Talk - Contributions 15:16, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  6. Energybender 18:53, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  7. User:lovingazula 19:03, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  8. Puragus Talk 19:10, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  9. Fireprince - i have an acount but can't make a link but you should count my vote too!

Image 5

  1. Lady Juse 05:10, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  2. SuperFlash101 05:43, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
  3. Zukofan123 05:44, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
This discussion is closed. The result of this discussion was:
Image 4 shall remain as the profile pic.
Please do not edit this discussion.

Character Information

I couldn't help but notice that underneith the picture of Zuko, it states that he has black hair. Howver, in the picture and other pictres/episodes, his hair is clearly brown. Perhaps 'Dark Brown' would be suitable? (I'm also new to this site. Sorry if this is displayed wrong :P) Pevalwen 17:15, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

Most images of him show him in some kind of lighting, and most of them make his hair look brown, you have no idea of how much debate there was over Aang's hair and eyes, and Ty Lee's eyes because of lighting. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 18:40, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

Maybe you can do the same for the other main characters? User:Luvingazula - Talk 20:22, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Other skills

I got two pictures of Zuko wall running. One should be put in the other skill section. But which one? User:Luvingazula - Talk 15:18, 22 March 2009 (UTC)


Image 1, he's more focused in this image. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 17:30, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Image 1, same reason as Omnibender. Katara-dobs-c2 - Avatar Junky -Talk 17:35, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

I'll take it everyone will agree with you so Image 1 will be added. User:Luvingazula - Talk 21:06, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

I'm not a big fan of either of the images. They both have big burs. Look at them up close, you'll see the blurs. Vaznock - Talk 21:25, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

I noticed them, thats why I asked first. User:Luvingazula - Talk 21:34, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

The blurring shows the speed. Anyway, I'm going with Pic 1. Zero Sign - Zero - Talk 22:02, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Images size

Why must every in-line image be 250px? We had a long argument about how 40px for the icons was too big, but then you use this needlessly huge image size on articles that sandwiches the body text. I don't get it. ― Thailog 17:43, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

I really don't know, when I first joined, I saw that there was no set image size, so I just saw which was more common and applied it in the other articles. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 18:18, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, the images look fine for bigger screen resolutions, but the larger images look bad on 1024 by 768. I think they'd look better with all at 200px, but I can't be stuffed... The 888th Avatar (Talk) 22:19, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Other Skills Image

I'd like to replace that pic of Zuko running on the wall with a pic of Zuko doing something as the Blue Spirit. I feel that Zuko truly showcases all of his non-Firebending abilities while he's in that disguise more than at any other time, and that would be very appropriate for the section. Plus, that section is loaded with nothing but pics of Zuko in his season-3 outfit, and a pic of him as the BS would break up the monotony a little bit (I get a little tired of seeing him in that outfit in the section, when there's more diversity in the way he looks over the seasons). Plus, the Blue Spirit looks really, really cool. Puragus Talk 21:48, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

That sounds like a good idea. The 888th Avatar (Talk) 23:18, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
I'll look for good pics and get back here later. Puragus Talk 23:30, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

Yeah. Also, we should have season 1 pics (exept at the north polr where he's all pale and scatched up) DaLucaray Rox ur Sox 23:09, February 24, 2010 (UTC)DaLucaray

Special firebending move

I was just looking and I noticed that something about Zuko I noticed was left out. Did anyone else realize that he often does something other firebenders do not. He sorta lands on his back and spins his legs, either to create fire or just as a normal fighting move. I can remember 3 instances: Fight with Zhao, fight with the kyoshi warriors, final agni kai with Azula. I have never seen another character do this, and I don't know what it would be called, but perhaps it should be added. What do you think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Spectic (talkcontribs). This note was added on 04:12, January 23, 2012 (UTC).

Seems to be a personal choice as far as I can see, not sure it's notable enough. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 17:54, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

You mean that little breakdance move he does? I've seen that move in a dragon style kung fu demonstration once, where the intent is to sweep out an opponant's legs and get back to your feet in one fluid motion.Hiroakira Fengxian (talkcontribs) 02:06, June 24, 2010 (UTC)


I know right? I think its cool. I am going to start calling it the Zuko Flame Breakdance. Written by : Artimis 99 --Unknown Wikian


Your right! I've seen Zuko do that move. I think we should mention that in the article. I've seen that in some episodes. --Anr0328 (talk) 23:40, November 21, 2010 (UTC)

Minor Problem with Blue Spirit Episode

I don't know if this is the right place to discuss this, and if not, feel free to delete it. In the episode The Blue Spirit, Commander Zhao requested the use of the YuYan archers from Colonel Shinu. However, Zuko's article mistakenly identified Colonel Shinu as as Commander Zhao's commanding officer. This is highly unlikely, since not only are they in separate branches of the military (Commander is a Navy rank, Colonel is an Army rank) but they are actually of equivalent ranks. This was simply a case of one officer asking another officer a favor, and being refused.

No Commander is below Colonel and the authority is the same, admiral on the other hand is above the rank of colonel. Valenthyne

Posible Inspiration

Zuko's history may be based on a condensed version of the The Lay of the Cid (Cantar del Mio Cid), about offending the king and the search for regain his honor.

I read it 1 week ago, and I don't think that because the Cid never lost his honor. He only was hated by the king. Dcasawang1 - Talk 21:27, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
Is not that way, the King was convinced by other guys, enemies of the Cid, to eciliate him out of Castilla. The main plot is the search for restoring his honor.

Zuko's Alias

As Iroh has his title "The Dragon of the West", Zuko is the "Dancing Dragon", alongside Avatar Aang. I think this detail should be added.

  • Iroh's was an honorary title and widely used, Zuko and Aang weren't even called that, they only said it was the name of the form they learned. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 16:25, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
  • BTW, the title of "Dragon" is only applied to firebenders that actually kill dragons (or like Iroh, lie about it). Zuko hasen't killed squat, so he'll just have to be content with Fire Lord as a title.Hiroakira Fengxian (talkcontribs) 02:01, June 24, 2010 (UTC)

Zuko and Katara

Under Trivia, it says "Zuko was originally intended to be Katara's love interest." That is not true. I don't have easily accessible evidence in my grasp at the moment (other than the commentaries on the DVDs) but I know that even if the creators didn't already have Katara paired with Aang, they have never intended Zuko/Katara. The play only brought in the Zutara angle because the creators were surprised and amused at the large fan base for Zutara (which they didn't expect) and they wanted to put this in one of the episodes, as a tidbit or a form of mockery, depending on whether you liked the Zutara portrayal in the play or were insulted by it. I've come across stuff on this before when Book 3 was still in production, but now I can't remember any sources. I hope someone knows what I'm talking about.--Secretss 12:54, September 27, 2009 (UTC)

I think that information was put in Avatar Extras. Dcasawang1 - Talk 16:09, September 27, 2009 (UTC)
Three out of the four statements there have an episode each to back them up. Except the Zuko and Katara statement. Pretty convenient, eh? What's to say a fan slipped it in there and people just take that article as truth? We can't cite a wiki article as source. And after looking at the other contributions from the unregistered person who added the Zuko line to Avatar Extras, I'm even more suspicious that the line is unmerited. --Secretss 17:29, September 27, 2009 (UTC)
~Perhaps some lines in the wiki entry of Avatar Extras were snuck in by fans, but that particular one was'nt. I watched it on Nicktoons as it aired. There is NO WAY that I could just forget something that significant; I even paused the screen(dvr) to make sure I was reading it right. - "Zuko was originally going to be the love interest for Katara. She does like bad boys." I believe that this extra popped up around the 1st time we get to see Katara and Zuko together, which would be episode 2: The Avatar Returns.
-So, yeah, it's actually completely true.
Yeah it is true that he was the original love intrest, but the extra you're talking about actually popped up in episode The Siege of The North, Part 1 when they were fighting at the spirit oasis. But yeah you're right on everything else. =D Momo Sprite*~~Ian Bernard~~*Momo Sprite 09:43, October 12, 2010 (UTC)


Why does everyone keep assuming Avatar Extras is true? It is not canon - they were additions made by Nick after the show had aired for some time as an attempt to boost their ratings. What's the best way to get more ratings/viewers? Tug the strings that interest their viewers the most! Mike and Bryan did not create the Avatar Extras.

The extra: "Zuko was originally going to be the love interest for Katara. She does like bad boys." Is horribly mis-understood. IMO, it's referring to the Ember Island Player's actress Katara, you know the one who's "Oh Jet, you're sooo bad."

And now for some proof on errors in the Avatar Extras.

[As Haru prepared to earthbend rocks to dust] About to show off.

Wrong. He's NOT showing off crumbling the rock to sand! He's reminiscing his father.

Oldest man in the Earth Nation.

We don't know his age. However, I'd wager Bumi beats him in age. (the guy trapped by the mine)

(In episode with Winter Solstice) Fact: Zuko has a hard time telling these Fire Nation soldiers apart.
He's actually never seen them without their masks.

WRONG! The very first episode has them without masks! (good luck spotting it like I did. It's right when Zuko shouts "Wake my Uncle!")

In the pilot episode, the creators commentary laugh that they were "shipping" Aang and Katara even in that. And then don't forget the interview with the creators; where they're commenting on the relationship between Aang and Katara. They reply that it was in the DNA of the show from the start.

So; with a big resounding No, Katara was not initially planned for Zuko. Their relationship was toyed with as the series progressed to add spice to the story, and make the final moment when the two (Aang and Katara) committed to one another all the more dramatic. Mike and Bryan are like that. Vulmen (talkcontribs) 22:23, October 12, 2010 (UTC)

Why?

Why do we have a Zuko Alone redirect? I mean, who's going to type "Zuko" while looking for "Zuko Alone"? DaLucaray Rox ur Sox 23:06, February 24, 2010 (UTC)DaLucaray


it has a somewhat similar name, all articles with similar names have one.
Yeah it's kinda similar.94.6.125.137 20:55, March 16, 2011 (UTC)A Wikia Contributor94.6.125.137 20:55, March 16, 2011 (UTC)

Zuko's hair?

Could Zuko's hair represent his personality in a way?

As a child, his hair is in a flowing ponytail-- could mean that he was free as a child, but slightly restained as all children are. Like a ponytail. Free, but restrained and restricted.

Throughout Book One, his hair is in a ridig ponytail. His personality is harsh, ill tempered, etc.

In Book Two, it starts to grow a bit, like he does.

At the start of Book Three, he has it pulled back. So it's like he's still growing, but has been restrained. Like he is when he returns home. I think the hairstyle is traditional if not only neat and Princely. Finaly, when he confronts his father, we see his hair is longer and freely wild again. It isn't restrained as he isn't. He's given up fighting for Oazi's love and approval.

Am I making snese? :) Kyoshi's Fan (talkcontribs) 02:41, May 24, 2010 (UTC)

Zuko's Story

The new prequel manga added some new information about the character, should this be noted?

What prequel manga? SSJ-Trunks 12:41, June 3, 2010 (UTC)

There was a prequel manga for The Last Airbender called Zuko's Story. It was basically about the aftermath of the Agni Kai.76.19.33.130 11:55, June 19, 2010 (UTC)Rabbitdash

I think we could include some of the information from the prequel.I should be able to get the book.Mai26 (talkcontribs) 14:59, June 19, 2010 (UTC)

I read it. It was pretty good, and it had a few surprises here and there. One of the biggest I thought was that Azula was the one that convinced her father to give Zuko a ship (granted, it was so long as he took Iroh with him). Hiroakira Fengxian (talkcontribs) 18:48, June 21, 2010 (UTC)

Firebending Level

I noticed that areas throughout the page indicate Zuko is not a Firebending master, yet he displays skills and techniques that I believe definitely make the title applicable to him. Thoughts? Kcets, the Music Man (talkcontribs) 06:25, June 4, 2010 (UTC)

Zuko's firebending has improved a lot, but during the series, not once he's mentioned as a master. No one has deemed him a master. It's like a title. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:15, June 4, 2010 (UTC)
How can you be under the tutelage of a grand lotus, for a long 4 years (and your grandfather master 3 elements in 12 years) without being a master? If Aang is a fully realized firebender and avatar, how could his teacher not be? Notice that katara and toph are said to be masters. Iroh is a master because of extensive training, and a visit to Ran and Shao, am i wrong or has zuko not done both of those and is related to both the avatar and the fire nation royal family? He's also one of two three people to know how to redirect lighting. This is a good arguement to make.-Fireprince
It definitely stands to reason that Zuko is a Firebending Master, it's just that the show neglected to state outright that he is a Master. After all, he never really came into his full potential until after "The Firebending Masters", and by that time there was no older mentor type around to officially declare him a master; they were all too busy with the war and I'd think that titles were rather low on the priority list. It wouldn't make sense for him not to be a Master, because even in Book 1 when he was still extremely novice, he could still defeat Zhao, who was a master, and evenly match Katara at the North Pole even though she'd already been declared a Master. And that was only in the first season; think of how much stronger he got afterwards. PlanetAva 23:25, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

A fully realized Avatar is an Avatar who can control the Avatar State. By the start of the finale, Toph and Zuko still though his Earthbending and Firebending had to improve. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:39, July 29, 2010 (UTC)

Some of his techniques are in Firebending Master list. DavidMC123 (talkcontribs) 20:37, July 31, 2010 (UTC)

And since he beat two Firemasters(Azula and Zhao) he has to be a Firebending master. The moves he did against Katara and Aang in the "Crossroads of Destiny" were definetely of high skill. Not to metion that he trained under the Sun Warriors. ZukoFromGreece (talkcontribs) 17:09, December 28, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah in Book One all Zuko knew was simple firebending blasts and shots. 94.2.141.239 19:23, March 6, 2011 (UTC)


If Zuko wasn't a master it would be impossible for him to beat Azula. 94.2.14.239 7:53, March 29, 2011 (UTC)

For everyone using the Azula claim he only beat her when her sanity started slipping. She wasn't at the same skill level she was at the beginning of book two. Zuko himself said she was slipping before the Agni Kai.
However I do agree that Zuko is a firebending master. For starters he is, and always has been, a very capable firebender. Also. I think all Fire Lords are considered to be firebending masters. Griffmstr835 (wallcontribs) 17:27, September 29, 2013 (UTC)

Pic

Does anyone think that this shuld be the new image?Courage the Cowardly Dawn's Past - SoF 23:33, August 5, 2010 (UTC)

Not sure. Unlike Aang, whose clothes in the last episode didn't show any known significant change in term of status, this one very clear shows that Zuko became Fire Lord. I would keep the current image for now. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:05, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

What are you insane??? If you compared Aang in his orignal outfit to Aang at the very end of the series in his outfit, it shows how much he has grown in ten months. It shows his change from playful little boy to a fully realized Avater With strength and resolve as strong as the Earth, I am an Earthbender 23:25, August 14, 2010 (UTC)

You can't tell that much by Aang's image. Compared to his original outfit, the only different thing is the bead amulet, which doesn't even show up properly. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 17:06, August 15, 2010 (UTC)

I still think this should be the new one since it is his most recent.--Courage 22:17, November 3, 2010 (UTC)

I think it's more important to have each character sport their characteristic look in the second half of Season 3. It's much easier to identify Zuko with the current image as being Zuko. The 888th Avatar (talk) 23:57, November 3, 2010 (UTC)

I have a site question

how did you get the Succession box to work on wikia?

--RJasonA30 (talkcontribs) 20:34, August 28, 2010 (UTC)


Eye color classification

According to wikipedia and bioligists a person with "Gold" appearing eyes has the classification of having "Amber Eyes". Therefore I hope you guys realize you have to change his eye color to Amber otherwise it would be like putting Aang's eye color, gray, as "silver." Therefore anyone knowing anything about the human eye would scoff at this page for miss-labeling the color of zuko's eye. same goes for the other people of the fire nation. Amber eyes appear when high levels of lipochrome are present in the iris. Usually lipochrome levels lead people to having green eyes although amber colored eyes are losing their rarity in recent times. Yue-Thaili-Poama-Exploding 21:22, September 2, 2010 (UTC)ExplosionsHurtPeople

understandable, but animated characters usually don't adhere to "real life characteristics". -- Bunai82 (talk)
Agree with Bunai82. Another example is that in Japanese anime purple and green are considered "natural" hair colors. Griffmstr835 (wallcontribs) 17:22, September 29, 2013 (UTC)

Image change

150px

We Should really change the Image to this.It's really better. VJavatar is avesome(let's talkHave you read AR)Azula Sprite 01:35, September 3, 2010 (UTC)

Not really. It was decided long ago that we should keep the current image because Zuko isn't Fire Lord for most of the series. Out of the entire series, Zuko holds the title of Fire Lord for less than 10 minutes of screen time. Therefore, to be true to his most common position throughout the series and to have a Book 3 image, the current image should stay. --I'm The Bos - Talk - Guardian 01:43, September 3, 2010 (UTC)

Zuko's swords

His dual broadswords are called shuang dao. I did a google search and the first few pics were dual dao sharing one sheath

After the war

After the war, in The Last Airbender: Legend of Korra, does either Zuko or Azula have any children? What happens to them? Does he marry? The Master's Voice (talkcontribs) 14:12, October 12, 2011 (UTC)

Family tree

Since it was revealed in the Search Part 1 that Ozai isn't Zuko's real father, should we alter his family tree or are the comics considered non-canon? M4ND0N (wallcontribs) 04:31, March 21, 2013 (UTC)

I think you folks are way too quick to assume that this is the case. Just WAIT.Fire Eater (wallcontribs) 04:31, March 21, 2013 (UTC)

Well it does give a possible explanation to why Ozai treated Zuko the way he did. Although we obviously need more proof, despite it being extremely likely, it should be referenced there in some way. M4ND0N (wallcontribs) 04:46, March 21, 2013 (UTC)

I think we have enough information now with the last comic, we must change the tree.  Leodix | My Talk | Contributions 20:19, July 26, 2013 (UTC)
It's not been confirmed one way or the other yet, so far, it's all been subject to interpretation. If there will be any changes, they will come after TSPt3. PSUAvatar14 Want to have a word? Katarasprite1Ty Lee KW 20:22, July 26, 2013 (UTC)
Is that also the reason Mai is not marked as being Zuko's wife or the mother of his kids? It seems pretty clear by now that Zuko isn't with another woman, and he does have kids before the events of The Legend of Korra. I think it's safe to add her to his tree. Griffmstr835 (wallcontribs) 17:16, September 29, 2013 (UTC)

What happend?

Where's Zuko now? I haven't heard anything about him. Did he die, or do we not know?Mezincha (wallcontribs) 02:48, September 14, 2013 (UTC)Mezincha

I'm assuming you mean in The Legend of Korra? I could be wrong, but I think Zuko is alive. Could swear they said he wasn't dead, but he is retired from being Fire Lord and I believe his daughter is the Fire Lord. Or Fire Lady. Griffmstr835 (wallcontribs) 17:18, September 29, 2013 (UTC)

Propulsion

The page does not acknowledge Zuko as one of the few firebenders shown to propel to the air using firebending. He used it in the final agni kai against Azula. FTWinchester (wallcontribs) 01:07, October 14, 2014 (UTC)

Zuko never used propulsion. During the Agni Kai you mentioned, he launched himself in the air by placing his hands on the ground and then firebending, which is not the same as basically flying by continuously propelling yourself with firebending. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 08:44, October 14, 2014 (UTC)
I beg to differ... propulsion in this case is using your firebending abilities to produce lift, which is what we saw zuko do. he even maintained his altitude for several seconds before intentionally coming crashing down with a massive fire wave.
Also of note, we have Avatar Wan listed on there, and his one instance of propulsion was less impressive than Zuko's. if we don't add zuko, then we have to remove wan. Intelligence4 (wallcontribs) 15:43, October 15, 2014 (UTC)
What we see Zuko do it deliberately placing his hands on the floor, aiming a blast on the ground to just launch himself in the air and then he uses the momentum of him coming down to add extra force to his attack. In no way is this propulsion in the meaning of the technique. As for Wan, his use of propulsion does fit the meaning of the propulsion technique: he used his firebending to propel him upward. His fire didn't need the resistance of the floor to launch him up like Zuko did, but he lifted himself up purely with his bending. That's the meaning of propulsion with bending. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 16:22, October 15, 2014 (UTC)
actually, if you watch the scene again, he didn't place his hands on the ground, he did the same thing as wan. but regardless, even if he did put his hands on the ground, it's still using his firebending to propel himself in the air. as far as "needing" the "resistance" of the ground, that really wouldn't have an effect on the fact that he still got some pretty good air as a result of firebending. Intelligence4 (wallcontribs) 13:52, October 17, 2014 (UTC)

I have rewatched the scene, I wouldn't have commented otherwise, so that also allows me to commented without a doubt that you're wrong when you say that he did the same thing as Wan because he clearly did not. The ground resistance has everything to do with the fact that he shot himself so high in the sky: his firebending was enhanced, so he easily shot higher than normal. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 13:57, October 17, 2014 (UTC)

"the fact that he shot himself...in the sky."
right there is the definition of propulsion. zuko used it. he might not have flown, which is what we've seen ozai and azula do, but he absolutely positively used propulsion. Intelligence4 (wallcontribs) 14:09, October 17, 2014 (UTC)
You're conveniently ignoring the how he shot himself into the sky, because if you would take that into account, you would be wrong with calling what Zuko did "propulsion". So before making a claim, it is really important to take all the relevant facts into account and not just the select ones you can use to try to defend a certain pov. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 14:28, October 17, 2014 (UTC)
it's equally important to not force irrelevant details into an argument. he shot himself into the air with firebending. that means propulsion. Intelligence4 (wallcontribs) 15:41, October 17, 2014 (UTC)

"it's equally important to not force irrelevant details into an argument." Good thing I'm not doing that then. Really, you're making this very tiresome. It's like talking to a wall who denounces the facts seen on the screen in favor of their own opinion. Propulsion is the technique where one propels himself in the air using solely the power of their bending. That means that they start to firebending into nothing and launch themselves in the sky. That does not mean using the resistance of the floor and the backlash of their attack being halted by something immovable to launch them in the air. Sadly, what Zuko did was the latter, meaning that he did not propel himself in the way the technique is described and meant to be used. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 16:02, October 17, 2014 (UTC)

"Really, you're making this very tiresome. It's like talking to a wall who denounces the facts seen on the screen in favor of their own opinion."
i never thought someone could describe my thoughts so well. if zuko didn't use solely the power of his bending, what else did he use? the airbending subskill of flight? how else did he get in the air? were he an earth or water bender, your argument of "pushing off the ground" might make sense, but fire isn't solid, and never comes into contact with the bender. (otherwise they'd have severe burns, as we saw with zuko's face - firebenders aren't heat resistant). the strong updraft created by the stark contrast in temperature is what causes them to fly. keeping basic physics in mind, it's irrelevant whether or not the flames touch something else when they fly.
and on that same note, if you rewatch the wan vs. vaatu fight, you'll see that wan's fire also touches the ground. if you want to continue to insist that what zuko did wasn't propulsion, that fine, but only so long as wan gets the same treatment. the least you can do is be consistent. Intelligence4 (wallcontribs) 20:52, October 17, 2014 (UTC)
Hi sorry if I am interrupting, but I would like to say that I agree with Intelligence4 because of two reasons. Firstly, the defenition (from our wiki) as it stands now is "Jet propulsion: Skilled firebending masters are able to conjure huge amounts of flame to propel themselves at high speeds on the ground or through the air." and in this defenition there is no minimum requirment considering airtime and there is no restriction in using the ground resistance to propel yourself ( just a little note, air also provides some resistance or else wings wouldn't work, but of course the resistance from air is considerably less than the resistance from the ground). Secondly, under the section "Jet propulsion" in the article "Firebending" it is stated that "Azula and Zuko both executed this technique while powered by the comet during their Agni Kai". So to summarize what I am trying to say is that with the current definition Zuko should be acknowledged as a user of this technique. This was the main point, but I would also like to add that I don't think that anyone of us can actaully see if Zuko touched the ground or not while he performed the technique, but could we at least agree that his hands were pretty close to the ground? Furthermore as you pointed out Lady Lostris Zuko performs this technique while enhanced by Sozin's Comet so we actually don't know if he can perform it without the comet and this goes for Ozai and Jeong Jeong too.ELEMENTAL UNITY (wallcontribs) 22:30, October 17, 2014 (UTC)
"and in this defenition there is no minimum requirment considering airtime and there is no restriction in using the ground resistance to propel yourself"
The minimum requirement has never been brought up as an issue, so that's indeed irrelevant. However, saying that there is no restriction using the ground resistance to propel yourself is just wrong. Yes, it is not literally stated that "Skilled firebending masters are able to conjure huge amounts of flame to propel themselves at high speeds on the ground or through the air [without using the resistance of the surface]" though that doesn't mean that it isn't the situation. If a waterbender uses a water tendril to slam hard on the ground and thus launches themselves in the air as a result because they cannot resist the backlash of their attack, are they then using "water propulsion"? No, they're not, they're just using a water tendril and the backlash of their attack threw them in the air. Zuko did just that: he used the resistance of the floor and the backlash of his attack to launch himself in the air. The technique is called "jet propulsion". Not once in that move did he create a "jet" with his firebending to fly, which is what the technique is about. Ergo, Zuko did not use "jet propulsion".
"Secondly, under the section "Jet propulsion" in the article "Firebending" it is stated that "Azula and Zuko both executed this technique while powered by the comet during their Agni Kai"."
That's not a definite argument, that's an oversight in the article. There is a reason why we don't accept Wikipedia as a definite source, because anyone can edit that and thus those pages could contain errors. Same here. This wiki is not error-free. You just pointed us to one of those errors that need to be fixed.
"I don't think that anyone of us can actaully see if Zuko touched the ground or not while he performed the technique"
Before I started this discussion, I looked at the relevant scene closely and even took screenshots to see what was going on (which is something that I always do to make sure that I know 100% what I'm talking about when it comes to details and am not just talking based on educated guessed.). As such, I can honesty say that we are able to see what happened: 1. Hands on the floor; 2. firebending to the floor; and 3. Continuing to fire at the floor and launching himself up. So as you can see: he clearly placed his hands on the floor and then solely shot himself up because the backlash of his attack could not be contained in the position he was in. If you then compare Zuko's move to those of Ozai and Azula and Jeong Jeong and Korra and Wan and Mako, you clearly see that they're doing something different, which leads to only one possible conclusion: Zuko did not use jet propulsion. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 13:14, October 18, 2014 (UTC)
Ok I am going to start of with the minor things. Firstly, when I said "I don't think that anyone of us can actually see if Zuko touched the ground or not while he performed the technique" I just meant that I don't think that anyone of us can confirm if his hands really do touch the ground or if they are a couple of centimeters above the ground, since the shot of him isn't zoomed in enough. However I don't think this thing with his hands matter to any of our arguments. Secondly, I agree with you that my second argument actually proves nothing except that another person also thought that Zuko utilised Jet propulsion. Furthermore, I only brought up the minimum requirment part because I tought that you hinted that you need to be in the air for a certain amount of time when you said "which is not the same as basically flying by continuously propelling yourself with firebending.", since you said continuously propeling yourself. 
Now to the more impotant part. After I looked at your pictures I began to watch the scene another ten times, and when I did it hit me and now I understand what your are trying to say. So I came up with this easy way of describing it wich is (Azula and all the others fly while Zuko hovers), So the diference beetween the case with Azula, Ozai and Jeong Jeong ( I don't know when it comes to Korra, Wan and Mako since I havn't seen the legend of Korra, but don't worry I will, I am just watching the Avatar franchise in a slow tempo so that it lasts longer) and Zuko is that he seems to be having a limited height to his flight unlike the others. For this reason I do agree with you that Zuko's technique is not the same as the other's. However I don't think that you can dissmis the defenition of Jet propulsion as you did when you said "However, saying that there is no restriction using the ground resistance to propel yourself is just wrong. Yes, it is not literally stated that "Skilled firebending masters are able to conjure huge amounts of flame to propel themselves at high speeds on the ground or through the air [without using the resistance of the surface]" though that doesn't mean that it isn't the situation.". If we have a defenition we should either follow it (if it is correct) or change it and I know that anyone can edit it, but I think that definitions are important and that it should be made harder to change them as is the case with changing a profile picture. Moreover wouldn't it be good to have maybe one or multiple separate pages with a long and complete definition of bending techniques with examples that not only describe a person using the technique, but also describe a person that uses a similar technique and explain why it is not considered to be the same. Anyway, to summarize my some what to long "imortant part" if we use your definition of Jet prupolsion, Zuko  didn't use the technique, but if we use the definition in the firbending article he did actually use Jet propulsion, so if you ask me the problem here is the defenition of Jet propulsion.ELEMENTAL UNITY (wallcontribs) 23:14, October 18, 2014 (UTC)
" I just meant that I don't think that anyone of us can confirm if his hands really do touch the ground or if they are a couple of centimeters above the ground, since the shot of him isn't zoomed in enough."
Eum ... no, we can clearly see that his hands are on the ground. But for argument's sake, I'll humor your proposition that they're hovering a few centimeters above the ground. Even so, that doesn't change the fact that Zuko is clearly counting on the resistance of the ground to launch himself in the air as opposed to solely relying on his firebending to do so -as Azula was clearly shown doing during their battle.
"except that another person also thought that Zuko utilised Jet propulsion."
That is true, but it's not because the majority in the fifteenth century believed that the Earth was the center of the universe that it was actually the truth.
"since you said continuously propeling yourself."
I apologize for the apparent confusion I created with that wording. What I meant by that is what I've always been saying and that is that jet propulsion means that you are propelling yourself in the air by using solely your firebending without needing it to be bounced off the floor as Zuko has only been shown to be doing.
"he seems to be having a limited height to his flight unlike the others."
But that's just it: Zuko does not hover. Zuko just launches himself in the air by aiming to the floor, using the ground's resistance to gain altitude and then just falls down again due to gravity. There is not one point that he hovers in the sense of this technique. Just, you could argue that he should've fallen sooner and he shouldn't have been able to twist in the air like he did without an power that would twist him around like that, but that's just the animation and the "let's make this look fancy" part of the show. Hovering with jet propulsion has been demonstrated by Jeong Jeong and what Zuko is doing is clearly not the same as that.
"If we have a defenition we should either follow it (if it is correct) or change it and I know that anyone can edit it, but I think that definitions are important and that it should be made harder to change them as is the case with changing a profile picture."
We are following the definition already -save for the person who edited in that Zuko used jet propulsion. However, this discussion has made it clear that more people are confused with the technique, so I'll be more than willing to agree to adapt the definition of the technique to clearly say that jet propulsion is the technique where one launches themselves in the air without needing the resistance of an immovable object to push them back using the force of their own attack against them.
"if we use your definition of Jet prupolsion, Zuko didn't use the technique, but if we use the definition in the firbending article he did actually use Jet propulsion."

There is no difference between "my definition" and the definition on the page. The definition now reads that "skilled firebending masters are able to conjure huge amounts of flame to propel themselves at high speeds on the ground or through the air." (emphasis added) The bolded part clearly states that it's the fire they conjure that propels them through the air. That means that they solely use their fire to move forward and don't rely on the backlash of their attack. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 23:31, October 18, 2014 (UTC)


"That is true, but it's not because the majority in the fifteenth century believed that the Earth was the center of the universe that it was actually the truth."

Well I didn't say that it was true just because this person wrote it in the article I just stated that another person shared my previous thoughts.

"But that's just it: Zuko does not hover.

When I said that Zuko hovers, I meant that he hovers like a hovercraft, which basically does the same thing as Zuko does (wich is using the momentum from the stream that they produce plus the momentum that is created by the backlash when their stream hits the ground, to sustain flight with limited height), but instead of using fire it uses air. I am also aware that he didn't stay in the air for a long time, but to launch oneself into the air and to hover for a very short time is theoretically the same thing. Moreover I clearly stated that  "For this reason I do agree with you that Zuko's technique is not the same as the other's", so I never said that Zuko did the same thing as Jeong Jeong, however I can understand that it was a little misleading when I said that Zuko hovers.

When it comes to the definition, I think that this defenition "jet propulsion is the technique where one launches themselves in the air without needing the resistance of an immovable object to push them back using the force of their own attack against them." is good,  but this one "skilled firebending masters are able to conjure huge amounts of flame to propel themselves at high speeds on the ground or through the air." is still unclear because even if part of text is bold I don't think it adds enough clarity since it is actually the fire that Zuko uses that creates the backlash , so he does conjure a huge amount of flame to propel himself , the fact that his flame creates lift with both its own momentum and the backlash force is not relevant. So in conclusion I agree with your first definition and would gladly see it posted in the firebending article ( with some minor modifications). However does everybody else agree with and if not shouldn't status quo remain. Furthermore now that we agree that Zuko's technique is not Jet propusion, should we create a new section describing his technique ( we could call it fire hovering or maybe fire jump or something like that) or is it too insignificant to have its own section. Finally, if we say that Zuko doesn't use Jet propulsion we are assuming that firebenders mainly create lift from the momentum of thier fire stream and not by heating the air below them to make it less dense and have the air push them in the desired direction and don't get me wrong I don't say that this is wrong for us to assume, I just say that our arguments doesn't make sense if we don't assume this. ELEMENTAL UNITY (wallcontribs) 19:57, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

Oh no, we would never bold part of the text, that just looks tacky :-p I just added the boldness to add the emphasis in the discussion so to have no misunderstand as to what I was referring to. But obviously, I'm fine with rewording the definition.
"should we create a new section describing his technique ( we could call it fire hovering or maybe fire jump or something like that) or is it too insignificant to have its own section"
In my opinion, we really should not create a separate bullet for Zuko, because the most natural way to interpret someone to be hovering is what Jeong Jeong did. Zuko just shot himself up in the air by aiming at the floor and then fell down due to the gravity. What Zuko did can in my opinion best be compared with two people running at each other with big bouncy balls, crashing, and then propelling each other back. Only difference is, Zuko flew upward and then down again as opposed horizontal, but that's irrelevant.
"if we say that Zuko doesn't use Jet propulsion we are assuming that firebenders mainly create lift from the momentum of thier fire stream and not by heating the air below them"
From what we've seen in the series, jet propulsion mainly just seems to be just that: creating lift from the momentum of their fire stream: the fire is nearly always bent behind them, so there is no way that they could be heating the air around them to left them up. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 21:11, October 19, 2014 (UTC)
How good that we have reached an agreement. However just a note, a hovercrafts flight mechanism and the bouncing balls your are talking about is quite the same except that the hovercraft has a continuous stream of bouncing balls (air) against the ground. I also now that the thing Zuko did can barely be called hovering, but when I reasooned if the technique Zuko used was Jet propulsion or not I thought of what Zuko did as the start of his flight and that he cancelled it midair, but then I realized that Zuko's flame unlike the others' flames always had contact with the ground, So now I think of it as a hovering aborted right after the start.ELEMENTAL UNITY (wallcontribs) 23:12, October 19, 2014 (UTC)  
"if we say that Zuko doesn't use Jet propulsion we are assuming that firebenders mainly create lift from the momentum of thier fire stream and not by heating the air below them"
"From what we've seen in the series, jet propulsion mainly just seems to be just that: creating lift from the momentum of their fire stream: the fire is nearly always bent behind them, so there is no way that they could be heating the air around them to left them up."
the only problem with that is that flames themselves can't produce momentum... they're just heated gas. "fire" is a chemical reaction, not something tangible. flames produce force by heat causing differences in air pressure. another thing... someone brought up the fact that waterbenders pushing off the ground with a water spout wouldn't be considered any form of propulsion. but again, that's because water is liquid matter, and actually transfers the kinetic/potential energy of the ground to the person on the other end of the water, which flames, a different form of matter, can't do. flames can only provide force by heating something up and producing a difference in pressure.
in summary, i haven't totally read all of what you guys wrote in my absence, but i want to say you should carefully consider the physics of what you see. also, nice screenshots LL, that's helpful. Intelligence4 (wallcontribs) 16:31, October 20, 2014 (UTC)
The firebending is used akin to a rocket thruster when used in the technique of jet propulsion. This is evidenced in the way Azula takes off at the Boiling Rock or when Korra takes off after Zaheer. As for your comment in regards to the water spout, that is completely ignorable, because the example wasn't about using a water spout to lift yourself off the ground and continuously ride the water, but about using a water whip to slam on the ground and being lifted off in return by its backlash (akin to how Zuko lifted himself off the ground). So in summary, you should carefully consider what it actually shown in the series and stated in the debate before making a comment about it allegedly being wrong. And thank you. I figured that we needed them considering you must've missed that part, or otherwise you wouldn't have called Zuko's technique "jet propulsion". Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 16:38, October 20, 2014 (UTC)

yes, firebenders propelling themselves are exactly like a rocket works, however, a rocket works by pushing off of the fuel it's burning (admittedly something we don't have in firebending, (they basically use their chi for fuel) but that's a separate issue for another day... i'd be happy to discuss the physics of that on my wall), not the ground. anyway, in the rocket you have a ton of fuel (usually hydrogen), and when they light it on fire, the rocket is propelled in the air b/c it has less mass, and therefore less inertia, than the fuel. it wouldn't matter at all if the other end of the flames touch something, for that is not what causes the propulsion.

similar to zuko, his flames are created between his hands and the ground, and this extreme difference in temperature causes a huge expansion of the air underneath his hands, which shoots him in the air. it wouldn't matter if he had done it from a standing position or if his hands were on the ground, the effect (and technique) are the same.

about the water, that example works as well. if you used a water whip against the ground to shoot yourself into the air, then you logic would work perfectly, because the water would literally use the ground's resistance to lift you in the air. but like i said before, fire doesn't do that. it uses the extreme expansion of air as a result of heat to lift one up... which can't depend on another object's resistance.

and no, i didn't miss the scene, i was simply commending you on actually providing some evidence. Intelligence4 (wallcontribs)

Since I'm a fact-oriented editor, I'm going to politely pass on your offer to discuss your speculation in regard to your theory on how firebending works as well as on going into the specific of how rockets work as that's not my area of expertise and I don't discuss something when I don't know what I'm talking about.
As for your believe that it wouldn't have mattered whether Zuko placed his hands on the ground or not, I'm just going to suffice with saying that you're wrong and urge you to read the entire discussion this time as opposed to repeating myself. You have to take the show into account and how it works there, thus the animation of techniques is important.
Since you're the one who needed the evidence to be shown you were wrong, it was my pleasure. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 18:33, October 20, 2014 (UTC)
"another thing... someone brought up the fact that waterbenders pushing off the ground with a water spout wouldn't be considered any form of propulsion"
Regarding the propulsion, the definiton of propulsion is a means of creating force leading to movement, so if we stick to the definition of propulsion almost everything should be considered Jet propulsion.
"the only problem with that is that flames themselves can't produce momentum... they're just heated gas." 
Correct me if I am wrong but heated gas is gas with higher velocity and thus higher momentum (at least if we look at each individual particle), So as long as the particles in the heated gas moves in the same direction it can actually create momentum. However what you say about flames providing force through heat is right, but what I said in an earlier post is "Finally, if we say that Zuko doesn't use Jet propulsion we are assuming that firebenders mainly create lift from the momentum of thier fire stream and not by heating the air below them to make it less dense and have the air push them in the desired direction and don't get me wrong I don't say that this is wrong for us to assume, I just say that our arguments doesn't make sense if we don't assume this." So the disscusion is not if it is the heat from the flame that leads to force, but what type of force is produced by the heat.
"it wouldn't matter at all if the other end of the flames touch something, for that is not what causes the propulsion." 
The reason why it doesn't matter to a rocket if the flame touches the ground or not is because the stream has enough momentum to lift the rocket anways, but for a hovercraft it does matter that the air stream it uses to create lift hits the ground or else it wouldn't be able to hover, and therfore hovercrafts have a limited height to their flight. Zuko's Flame remains in contact with the ground for its full duration hence his flight is more reminiscent of a hovercraft than a rocket, nevertheless I still think that Zuko can use Jet propulsion since he is a very skilled firebender, but unfortunately we have no proof so we can't know for sure.
Finally about the Firebending physics, I have actually already taken a look at the disscusion you started and it was very intresting, but as someone in the disscusion stated the physics in our world doesn't really apply to the Avatar world and therfore it is really hard to make a good theory about firbending, yet some good sugestions to how firebending works were brought up at the disscusion.ELEMENTAL UNITY (wallcontribs) 22:08, October 20, 2014 (UTC)
Lady Lostris, I personally you're being very strict about this. Zuko propelled himself into the air, the discussion isn't whether he used "Hovering" or "Sustained flight/levitation". He propelled himself into the air with firebending. Why do you have to make it so complicated? In fact, the definition of Fire Propulsion in the Firebending Article states that it ranges from short outbursts to sustained use. Zuko qualified with the short burst, so what's the problem? You do know actual rockets also rely on action and reaction for propulsion, right? However, it has nothing to do with the ground. Solid object/ground or not, a powerful fire blast will have thrust regardless. The ground could not lift you up, it doesn't work that way. It's the blast from the fire that creates thrust. Unless you think Zuko or firebenders are like balloons that rely mostly on increasing internal pressure and expanding gases for their flight, or that Zuko's fire acts like muscles that "push" on the ground in order to lift him up, then okay. FTWinchester (wallcontribs) 23:53, October 24, 2014 (UTC)
All your misgivings have been addressed in the previous posts. Please read the discussion again. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 00:05, October 25, 2014 (UTC)

Profile Picture

So hey I was wondering since Zuko is in both series should we put like a tab thingy to show what he looks like in TLA and LoK? Just an idea :D

NTA65bz, wanna chat? 14:01, October 24, 2015 (UTC)

It was already discussed in a previous war room forum, and the community consensus was not to add tabs on infoboxes. Waterbending emblem Water Spout 01:27, October 25, 2015 (UTC)
Oh, really? Okay then thanks for telling me ;) NTA65bz, wanna chat? 14:42, October 25, 2015 (UTC)

Zuko's Hair Color

Although certain fans of the cartoon and comics say it is simply lighting and Zuko's hair is very dark brown, even using the comics as "proof", it seems to have changed color from Book 1: Water as formerly black hair. I would agree for Book 2, Book 3, and the following trilogies that when his hair appears black, that it's the lighting or a possible goof, since it appears dark brown in most episodes of the following 2 Books and most pictures of the comics; it seems to be an error of black hair or just lighting such as when the Fire Sages crown him in the last episode, but in Book 1, his hair always appeared as black, mainly in a ponytail. For example, in the 2nd part of the solstice when making his decision to run the blockade, his ponytail is definitely black, just like in all the other episodes of Book 1. What would you say?Mistystar31 (wallcontribs) 00:11, November 12, 2015 (UTC)

I do have to agree that I find it quite difficult to say that Zuko's hair was dark brown overall, when it clearly was indisputably black in Book 1. In the other books and possibly the flashbacks, I agree with dark brown, but his ponytail was black in B1 was black, nothing brown about that. Lady Lostris vstf (talkHotN) 07:06, November 13, 2015 (UTC)